Cleanawd project

Well I figured I need to give Mike Leclerc some friendly competition for this summer, so I may as well share my progress aswell.

Here's the car for those that don't know


I have been starting off fairly slow, as I need to hear an "OK" from the powers above before I start on the power plant, but this is what I have so far:

Basically everything in the front end I want new.
So I got:
-Balljoints
-Tie Rod Ends
-Wheel bearings + seals
-sway bar end links
-And a Poly Bushing set for the front end

Sand Blasted front subframe


Painted with Poly bushings


Shitty old control arms


Stuff ready to get put together



Control arms on


The subfram was a perfect candidate to practice with my new welder, so try and ignore the practice welds

I will keep this updated.

MK

About time you posted something!!!

Nice!

Nice is right...that car looks like a twin to mine!

Very clean looking and the rims suit it so well.Oh happy bday Will.

Ahh, I really love 1ga's. Nice job.

Good Job! Keep it up

Now that's some nice work there! Keep it up, and the bottom of your car will be cleaner than the top!

For true DSMer the bottom is more important then the top.

Didn't do much tonight,

Cleaned up my steering rack. I really wanted a new one but oh well.

Tomorrow I am going to get new lines for it.


Here is a couple other things laying around.
hks 272 replicas



6bolt 4g64 crank, I need to take that away someday too.



Thats all for now.
MK

Nice rack mike!

why thank you

make sure none of the rusted parts are going back!

Just try to imagine it without all the dust/grinding chunks all over it.
And I am going to have to do something about those nasty looking struts..





Just got these in the mail today....

wow! That is deep! Keep posting pics!

Hey, nice evo springs, I got me a set too.

thx. I was wondering when someone point out what they were.
I hope they work out.

2.4 block and crank is off to the machine shop.
Guh... I'm so far behind.....

damn all that wiring ... !!

It should be very neat when I am done.
All the stubs are not being used anymore. and most of the long wires to the right are going to be cut aswell.
Everything else to the left is for the engine.

I got a nice 15pin connector off a Jbody. That should run all my engine sensors/wires, minus the alternator and oil sending unit wires at the front.
So everything can be easily disconnected at that one plug.

So I sorta lost the urge to be displaying everything about my car on the interweb.....

I havent taken off my 2600 for the past 3 years when I put it on. Took it off, and found this:



Every crack you can see I can feel with my fingernail. fubared!

Got the wheel bearings pressed in and car is back on 4 legs.
Waiting for the word on the damn machine shop so I can order my bottom end.

Next is taking out the pedal assembly and getting rid of that inch of slop in the clutch..... I am picking up a 24 for that one. so excited

Looking good man hope you get her done!

I'm getting there.
-Clutch pedal is welded
-I started tearing down my head last night to get it surfaced.

Seems Like no one stocks 6 bolt 2.4 pistons, not even Magnus. And Wiseco isn't doing a batch until mid May.
Zigster thankfully found me a solution.

sh!t tonne of parts to come.

I thought JE had some 2.4L pistons with the 21mm pin. Aside from machining the rods what solution would you have? Though I'm sure Ziggy hooked you up just fine.

Yes, Manley is customizing a set of rods to use the 7 bolt pistons

I was unable to find any ON THE SHELF anywhere. JE might make them.....but no-one has them (that I could find). They are a stock part number at Wiseco also, but none available until May...

http://www.extremepsi.com/store/customer/product.php?productid=21498&cat=1098&page=1

Hmm, well it states ships in 4-7 days, so I suppose they might not have them in stock. Well it's good that a rod set is coming right from Manley.

Like Ziggy said, there was none, Anywhere.
I called: Punishment, Magnus, DsmGraveyard, VR Speed Factory.
Ziggy tried all his connections.

I found a set on Ebay, but they were going to be about 600US when they hit the boarder with the slowest shipping. And they ship UPS. So I would have to make SURE to order some lube with that, for when I pay the brokerage fees.
Not to mention its EBAY.

Can't wait

When Extreme posts "ships in 4-7 days", that means he does not stock them. That means he either orders them in as ordered, or gets the supplier to ship DIRECTLY to the customer. He has NO way of knowing IF they are in stock at any given point in time. I just ordered in a turbo from him that "ships in 4-7 days", but it is going to be at least three weeks. He doesn't advise that until after the order is placed and he finds the inventory status at the suppliers
Also, for the record, if it says "on order", he is waiting for more stock, and if it say "out of stock" he is not sure if he will be getting more or not, or at least he knows it will be quite a while until he gets more..

I feel sick...

Motors finally going back tonight for machining.

I am trying to find some NEW connectors/pigtails for my TPS, 91+ Cam sensor, and possibly injectors.

Anyone know where I can find some of these?

Are you actually looking for Brand NEW connectors? Regardless consider switching to something like the 2g-style injector connectors - so much better and you don't have any of those stupid metal clips to lose.

Grumpy Update:
Machine shop told me they CAN do a MLS gasket as that was the first question I asked when I walked in there. But I don't think he knows what that means, or understand the surface I am expecting, as there is only a surface ginder there. (I read it has to be milled) He said they couldn't measure or show me the surface finish of what the gasket calls for right on the package, because "the tools cost too much and no one has them"
Guy said that the surface grinder is fine for the little boost I will be running.....??(I told him built for 40 but running 30ish)

I asked him if that was gauranteed to seal but then the truth came out and he said oh I dunno.... I dont do much of these little motors, you can listen to your books or the internet, or listen to me.

So I am now on the quest for a new machinist/milling machine...


Charles, Yes I am looking for new plugs. Injectors I think will be easy to find as even Summit has some that should work. Magnus makes the swap harnesses with new CAS plugs, so I will ask them where they source them. The only thing left I think is the TPS... if anyone can help with that one?

Mike,

For the record, a surface grinder gives a MUCH better finish than a milling machine! A mill will ALWAYS leave tiny scratches from the individual cutting tips.

A mill is more useful for removing larger amounts of metal, but the surface grinder will give a finer finish.

oh, I got my info from here.....

http://www.dsmtuners.com/forums/articles-engine-fuel/303225-engine-machine-work-explained.html


"Another machine is the surface grinder, not a bad machine, it keeps the head leveled and indexed, it uses segmented stones. The surface finish is not smooth enough most of the time for MLS gaskets, The finish is dependent on what stones, how well dressed they are, spindle speed and table speed. Still very common in shops

The new boy on the block is a High speed Milling machine, these use a .500 (1/2) inch insert, CBN for cast Iron and CBN for alum. for the most part, as far I as know, have been around about 10 years. smaller shops are slow on getting them due to there cost, But without a doubt give the best surface finish. Some machines, Like the comec I use, have variable rate spindle speed and variable rate table feed rates. This will alow for diffrent surface finishes for diffrent gaskets"

No automotive machine shop is going to have a high speed machining CNC to use for surface finishing. Take internet info for a grain a salt. That info above isn't the greatest.

CBN is the next hardest material to diamond. There doing something right if there at least using that. But it all comes down to care and preperation for the finish out come. Just let them know that your concerned about the surface quality and will be checking upon pick up. Usually thats enough to get the guy to put extra care into the quality.

I have an ANSI surface panel sample to compare to judge the surface quality.

I wrote a huge paper in university on surface finish so its a bit of my expertise Ra isn't all it cracked up to be.

I took my stuff to another place today and the guy seemed to have the same attitude when I said it needs to be between 30-50Ra. He said it doesnt matter, and his machine can do 50-70 and it will work fine. (I sorta feel like a douche now, but at least he could give me numbers on the finish)

After I asked a few more questions, I could tell he had the look on his face of "Shut up Kid, I Know What I'm Doing"

So I left it with him, and even though it's an hour away, I can get the boring, surfacing, align hone, and balancing all done at the same place.

I will be shootin up Thursday if anyone wants to join

Well that kit was too good to be true....

Mike,
that info on surface finishes was wrong. I think even the BEST high RPM CNC milling machine is going to have a tough time getting as good a surface finish as a mediocre surface grinder..

Segmented wheels? Not sure where this guy gets his info? Maybe on a Blanchard grinder which is a bit of a dinosaur. Any decent reciprocating grinder will give you a better finish than milling...

Sounds like your engine is in good hands

I guess reading can only get me so far.
I knew when i seen a block welded back together, and couple thousand hp drag motor sitting there that my stuff was in the right hands.

This is my first time doing this. ANY feedback is welcomed.

Got a call from the shop and he has a problem and I need some help.
I brought in 2 heads one was messed from the guide removal(oops)
The other was an additional spare I had.
He measured the spots where the cams sit, and he said that they are off quite a bit(I forget the measurement). And when he puts a straight edge on it, you can actually rock it back and forth.(This happens with both heads)

He is wondering if when you torque the head down, the cam spots will even out?
He said he has a e-mail into some other places, and wants me to check into it aswell.

Anyone else run into this problem?

both of my spare heads are screwed. FAK me

Got a 3rd head from a local guy and the cam journal was spun on it.
Double fak me...

Mike, will a 7 bolt/2g head do?

I started assembling my bottom end.
Even though my block was align honed I decided to Plasti gauge it anyways.


Then I couldn't believe my eyes, so I decided to do it again. and this fracking happened.



I was on the 3rd step of torquing them down. I did 40, 60, then I flipped it on to 80 and 2 of them started to spin too easily. Finally one cracked. at maybe 65ft lbs?? another one is defiantly stretched.

I want to know HOW THE frack they expected ANYONE to torque those down to 120ft lbs using motor oil, when I cant even get to 80 with the lube...

So
-3 of my heads have been bad,
-my mains have clearance issues,
-and I just broke some arp main studs for no damn reason.
I got another set on the way, but I am thinking of putting this bullshit on hold...

Mike, I am not sure what the torque specs are, but I KNOW it is a lot LOWER with the lube than with motor oil,,,,,

If they are supposed to be 120 with motor oil, they are probably only supposed to be around 80ft.lbs with the lube...

Mike,

I just opened a package to check the torque specs...supposed to be done in three equal steps to SIXTY ft/lbs...

my instructions say 80

are these the main studs or the head studs?

So for the record, they are mains, and looks like i got the wrong instructions in my box. They will be getting a call today.

Somehow, ARP put instructions for 12mm studs into the box with 10mm studs. They are replacing the studs....new ones are on their way to Mike with the CORRECT instructions....

and Ziggy rules.

Plus one!

Well head #4 seemed to be the lucky one....
I am finally making progess. and I am quite broke I hope to have it sitting in the car by the end of the week.











[img]http://i160.photobucket.com/albums/t175/II_Sp1kE_II/Front%20end%20Rebuild/IMG_0128.jpg[/img]

My Build Is Looking Good Keep At It Mike And Get Some Paint On That Block

Yes your build is looking good, lol.
Jeff has been my goto msn guru, and a handfull of ideas/parts were his choosing.

The block is painted . its "cast iron" I figure I would stick with its roots.

Its coming along nicely Mike. Keep up the good work

Thanks Rob I hope it pays off

Forgot to mention, that with the new arp's and the right torque on the mains, the plastigauge turned out perfect.

I got the head all assembled tonight, and frost plugs in.
I went to do the timing belt and realized that the G4CS Crank sprocket does not work. I beleive it has the same amount of teeth, but it has a lip on the timing cover side. The SOHC belt is slightly smaller, and this lip does not allow the 4g63/4g64 DOHC belt to sit in there. So I tried to pull the crank sprockets off my original motor, but after 2 hours of hitting it with an impact, and putting all my weight on it with a johnson bar, it would not budge. So for tonight, I am stuck and pissed. Would a 2g crank sprocket happen to be the same as a 1g?

The 1G and 2G sprockets are the same.

Take care of that wiring before you put it in. You'll thank me or curse me later.

he he, thanks Tim I will be yelling your name when I'm doing it . Ps happy birthday.

I made some progress. This sh!t takes longer than I thought.
I ended up cutting off my crank bolt to get the timing sprocket off.



Cam gear timing marks are rotated half a tooth Clockwise to compensate for the 6mm higher deckheight on the g4cs/4g64.(as per a post on tuners) And a DOCH 4g64 timing belt is used.
I just threw on my 2.0 timing cover. The top few bolts need to be left out, again because of the 6mm taller deck height. (I don't think there is a solution for this?)
Also another odd thing I ran into. I wanted to reuse the 2.4 n/t water pipe, and noticed that the mounting bracket for the block is about a half inch closer to the pump. So the oring would not seat fully in the water pump. I notched out the mounting hole to slide the pipe all the way into the pump, and still mount it to the block.

Looks good and clean. Reminds me of mines on the stand except for the forward oil filter.
What did you torque the L19's to ?

Thanks,
I put them to 80. Will that be good?

I did mines to 110 ft lbs with moly the other day. A1's and Felpro 1153-1 . Was at 110 ft lbs last year as well.

If you don't feel comfortable going that high, I would suggest minimum 95 ft lbs.

wholy balonge... 95 it is.

Reza, your nuts.

It's coming together Mike, good to see especially after the few issues you had.

I retorqued the L19's to 100, boy that was nerve racking especially after breaking my mains.
Reza, If I decide to pull the head off one day, have you reused that Headgasket?

And boy, I need a new valve cover... I think I will have to call Mr. Brightside one day...

Hopefully the motor will be in today.

I don't mean to hijack your thread with my pic but I told you it reminds me of mines

Get a new HG if you decide to take it off. The tacky material comes off. You shouldn't reuse a headgasket anyways.

Brings a tear to my eye.

Beautiful builds guys.

Damn I wish I had the cash flow to do this.

I'd love to do a full rebuild of my engine and car...at least the engine bay.

Hahaha, oh man, same engine stand and all, thats freaking great.

Engines in

I didn't notice the fuel rail until now. VERY slick. Are you going to be using the butterflies in the cyclone?

not using the butterflies.
The manifold was made by Jeff White, it was all taken apart, including the end of the plenum, with the butterflies removed and the whole thing was ported.
The second set is going to be activated around 10psi by my megasquirt. so i will only have 450's running while cruising around town.
Last year I tried running all of them all the time but had idle problems. I will see if that is fixed this year.

SO. I am happy I forgot to put in cam seals because when I pulled the valve cover, I noticed I am missing the little cap that gives you access to the oil ports in the head. I checked ALL 3 other heads that I brought to the machine shop along with the parts boxes they gave me back and they were all missing! SUPER pissed.

The little cap ?
I think your talking about the hydraulic lash adjusters oil regulator.

Bingo, that would be it. Now I can feel smart when I call them up. Thx

I'm on a Kiggly HLA
http://www.kigglyracing.com/parts/HLA_Pressure_Regulator.htm

Ah for sh!t sakes Reza I may have to, just to keep our builds looking like twins.
Only difference, I will probally run a 12.9 or some garbage. Being I found out that the machine shop that did the work on my motor does FP's motors. GUH

So after a frusterating month.
-I got a new pan to fix an oil leak.
-My stainless oil feed acted as a ground when my starter grounded out, and melted the rubber on the inside. so I got a new one.
-My balance shaft plug leaked
-And now I think I figured out my shitty idle, I pulled my manifold to fix an exhaust leak, and port 3 and 4 were wet with fuel. So I am pretty sure my injectors are leaking.
-On the plus side I took her for a little rip and 9psi feels great I wonder what 30 will feel like.

Next step is injectors + etest...
Then it is time to spank leclerc

Anyone got a good working set of 390's?

Taking tips from Christine huh?!?!?!

Lovin' it! LMAO

ya ya and she screams your name while in bed with me too..... guhhhhh

I am going slow and steady. Lots of problems that I have overcome. I guess I am looking at next year...

I got this done last night. It barely fit. But that means no more rice-ass apillar pod.

That's a nice clean install there good work! I assume it's a WB O2 display?

Nothing but

Yeah I didn't think you'd spend that kind of time just to find out if your narrowband sensor worked or not I have the NGK AGX wideband, so it's a big jesus display sitting on top of the steering wheel, someone asked me if it was a taxi meter, ha-ha

Ya I heard those are more accurate then the aem...
but I guess I will work with what I got..

I never got on the road this year.(legally)
After I blew up my first MS, 2 years aga and rebuilt it, I think something is still not right, and the car never ran right.

I broke down and got got a new one:

-MS2
-8 injector Sequential, staged injection
-Meth pump trigger
-Launch control
-GM Flex Fuel sensor ready (if we ever get e85)
-4bar MAP
-New harness(ripping all the stock sh!t out.

The guy building it for me is out of Quebec.
He is still working on testing the staged injection with the newest code.
Should be a real treat

When will you finally listen to me and get DSMLink!!! I thought you got MS in the first place because of all the money you would save...

Coming from the guy who doesn't own DSMlink. and has 4 dsm's none of which are road worthy.

Own three and two are road worthy (The spyder only came off the road because I bought the IS250). One just needs to have a broken bolt removed and replaced because someone who was helping removing my tranny forgot to tell me they loosen a very important bolt, one that holds an axel support... lol And why do I need DSMLink when I have the wonderful 98 ECU in both of my 2g

Oh I forgot about the 96, that is the brother project and you know that thing is like the day it rolled out of the Normal, Illinois plant so it is also road worthy

Quit filling the interweb with crap. homo

So all winter I have kept quiet and been collecting parts. Getting ready for alot of changes.
I have had this design in my head for awhile and I finally put it all together.
I guess I can let the cat out of the bag.

-I switched to a water to air intercooler setup with a much shorter intake route
-I got some new high imp injectors 650cc mains 1150cc secondaries(just incase we get E85)
-Got some fancy HKS timing gears
-Switched to a -12an drain setup for the Holset
-Snaged a koni/oldschool DSS Coilover setup and addred some upper camber plates.
-and finally...... I jumped on the Compound Turbo band wagon. with a 16g and hy35 for now.

Pics:

looking good mike, i guess this means im going to have to get off my arse and update my build thread too eh? do you have a finish date in mind yet?

That holset cold side looks amazing

Hmm forward-facing(done cheap) and half(or honda-sized) rad. I like it - I have a feeling you may yield some good results.

If it ever makes it out of the garage!!!!!!!!!!!
Problem is, he has a girl that's out of his league taking up all his free time

Love is for pussies, Mike!!!!!

looks good

Thanks,
I hope to have the car started about a week after I get my final bit of parts. I am not too sure, it will happen when it happens. I still gotta finish the re-re-wire and hope everything works how I want.

One of my regrets building this is I should have put the second wastegate exit pipe right beside where the first wastegate dumps back into the exhaust stream. I have a little bottle kneck there now...
I may have to make a version 2.0

awesome set up! come a long way since I last seen it.

Any updates on this?

I parted it out.
The shell went to someone local.
The motor and most of the goodies went to a sleeper colt project.

Watch the Classifieds for the leftovers!

That's balls.

sh!t happens

JUST KIDDING!

I did lose almost ALL motivation though, I have barely worked on it.

I got the car running, It had a nasty miss, so I ordered some new wires. Then before I got my wires, I picked up a JMF intake with a Q45 TB and with a second set of injector bungs. I tore it all apart to fit the intake.
I also got a Tial 50mmQ BOV and have some Avid mounts waiting for me at RTM.

So now the car is back into construction mode while I rejigg the fuel lines, IAT sensor, and wiring.

But here is the pics! (sorry for quality)

I was almost pissed off for a second. Can't wait to see this thing running.

^ X2, I was like WTF!

Weeeee out of the dungeon...

Did you fix your misfire issue?

It is running better, not perfect. I sent the ECU away to a friend of a board member, he said there was a bunch of stuff that he had to change...

I am pretty sure my 16g is leaking oil into the exhaust, sigh..... never trust kijiji sellers.....
I have a friend with my old 14b that he is going to let me use for the time being.

Been driving it up and down my lane way... hopefully i can get it road worthy shortly...

It is running better, not perfect. I sent the ECU away to a friend of a board member, he said there was a bunch of stuff that he had to change...

I am pretty sure my 16g is leaking oil into the exhaust, sigh..... never trust kijiji sellers.....
I have a friend with my old 14b that he is going to let me use for the time being.

Been driving it up and down my lane way... hopefully i can get it road worthy shortly...

Bit of an update.
Well I got off my ass finally.

I converted the Compound setup back to a stock 14b, realized when pulling off the downpipe that my cat exploded and had a bunch of honecomb chunks that fell out.
The car still did not run correctly.

I finaly said enough is enough!!!!
I tore out the Megasquirt ECU, removed the engine harness that came with it/I built.

I went out into the shed and started searching for all those stock parts I never thought I would need again.

I found an enginebay harness. It was a 90... but I converted it to a 91.
I found a MPI relay buried in a box. I dusted off a stock ecu out of the pile.
I then went and grabbed a stock maf off the shelf.... I would have never thought I would be putting a stock maf back onto my car....
While grabbing the maf, I also grabbed my box of fuel injectors and o-rings.

Over the past few nights I:
-Ran the stock wiring harness
-Converted the harness to 91 spec and modified some lengths to fit my JMF intake.
-Switched my brand new 650cc main high impd injectors for some 450cc stockers :S
-Jammed in the stock 1g maf to fit with my water-2-air setup.

I have a slow oil leak and the oil was low. I will grab some oil this weekend and fire it up.

Fingers crossed that it runs correctly, that I can get it etested, aligned and wheels balanced... So this hacked up, now not so clean car can make it to the Invasion

wish me luck.
Hope to see you guys next weekend

Good stuff Mike, I was waiting for your update!! Can't wait to see it!

So I got the car running pretty good on stock wiring and ecu.
Took it for a rip up the road to the neighbours, while pulling into my lane, the car started rattling.
Parked it in the garage, and there is a nice rattling coming from the bottom end.

I will post pics tonight of the carnage. My DSM days may be over

THAT SUCKS!!There is nothing worse then that feeling when you know you just got bit by the dsm wallet snatcher

Sucks dude

Dude!

I took off work early to check this out. It was bugging the hell out of me...
So this little bolt can go to hell:


I pulled the transfercase and that little bugger fell out from where ever it was hiding. I am guessing it was grinding up against the flywheel somehow...

I pulled the pan any ways... and it moved freely.

So good news I guess....

Bad news..... car currently looks like this now:


Odds of me getting it together, running correctly, etested, aligned, and wheels balanced in time for Sunday...??? haha

deja vu from 4 years ago??

Bum, sorry to hear that Mike, hopefully you can get her all back together.

Ok I am almost ready to take the car out. I may have insurance on it for this weekend...

I am STUCK on one thing...

When I have the car warmed up, and i ground the Timing connector, I can hear the motor change tone so it goes to fixed timing..

I connect the timing light to cylinder #1 but the dot on the crank pully does not show up!! no matter how far I spun the CAS.
I verified that the cam sensor was not 180 out, but tried flipping it anyways and the mark still didnt show up...

Any ideas?

Maybe it is there and can't see it? Did you mark it with whiteout?

Ya it is marked with whiteout

So when you rotate the cams by hand does everything line up? Crankshaft sprocket and cams.

yupp, and the dowels on the cams are pointing upwards.

Make sure your logger isn't plugged in while you're setting the timing or it will lock the ISC instead of the timing. In any case, you should still see the marking whether or not the ECU has control. The only time I saw it way off was with the CAS 180 out, it was jumping all over the place but still visible. Does your timing light have any adjustment on it?

ok, I will check to make sure that wire is not grounded. the plug is cut, so maybe that wire is touching the center console or something.

Another thought. I converted to a 91+ CAS plug. If the cam and crank trigger wires got flippes, would the car still run, and cause this problem?

And yes, my light is adjustable

Besides that stuff, I think the #1 spark must happen at the same time in the cycle for it to run properly, so clamping to #1 you should still expect to see the mark on the crank pulley. Unless the pulley is separated and spun, but that should be obvious..

Make sure the light is set to 0 and the procedure should be by the book. You could adjust the offset and see if that brings the marking around, if anything it could give a degree number to think about.

ok. Thanks Rob.

It is actually a Fluidampr unit. I checked the fluidampr against a stock pully, incase it was from a different car or something, but the marks line up fine..


I will play with it tonight.

If for whatever reason you still can't seem to get it, perhaps try this method out:

http://www.dsmtuners.com/forums/art...ng-without-using-lower-timing-cover.html

Got the timing set I was on the wrong plug wire.... i shoulda took the cover off see what assuming gets you

I must have a vaccum leak somewhere, I get idle surge when warm.

Anyways. I got the car in for an alignment, after 2years..? of the new front end stuff being on the car.





WOO HOO front end is now tight as hell. feels so good.






Oh, and she takes off liek a god damn rocket

Looking good

I have an extra set of eclipse tails i might be willing to part with if you want a nicer looking center section. And they are black also

If you want to bring her by oneday we could hook up a boost leak tester and find that leak.

humm, details on these tails?

If I cannot get my compressor out of the shed, I will let ya know



I also took the car for a quick drive after tightening my motor mounts, its getting more and more fun to drive every day...
I got a handfull of complements on the car aswell, with it coated in dust...

anytime.. well anytime on weekends that is.

I am in love again
Took er out last night, and drove it to work today (30min highway)
Although the night before the throttel got stuck in a 30km/h... worst feeling EVER! when your car goes WOT and you do not expect it.

I forgot to mention, the idle surge issue seems to be because of the TPS idle switch in the Q45 TB.

Also something to note on the Q45 TB, that the built-in idle switch will actually invert when adjusted too far one way.
So it is possible for the switch to be grounded while the throttle is open, and become ungrounded when the plate is closed.

Had that happen on my Spyder when I first got it, taking off at a light the spring broke, not fun but sure gets you puckered, lol.

Car is lookin sexy man!

Nice! Car's looking sexy!

That is scary for sure.

Had it happen to me inbetween shifts on the highway at WOT. Beach was bouncing off the rev limiter.

Got me clenching my ass cheeks pretty hard.

LOL!

Car passed etest this weekend.
2.4L with 272 hks profile cams.


Little FYI on "Hot Rod Etest"

2 years ago I had tried getting the car tested as a "Hot Rod"
Which it failed. The tech inputed that it had a 2.4L motor after I gave my story where the block came from, etc.

Fast forward to this past weekend, I had the test done at a buddys work place. He said he could not set it up as a "Hot rod"
I was kind of like wtf....??

But to my suprise when the page was printed, it listed the motor size as 2.4L.
So when the tech at the one shop inputted 2.4L 2 years ago, it kept record of that change to my VIN. (No need for the drive clean tech's to set the motor size every time it needs testing.)

It may be basic knowledge, but I thought I would share.



Also:
The water to air setup is effing amazing, Even with the little core.
I was doing lots of pulls last night, boosting over and over again.
I parked the car, everything was burning to the touch under the hood.
The center section where the water flows through on the intercooler, i could lay my cheek on it was so cool!!!
I wish I had air temp logs!

Mike, I am trying to walk through your compound turbo setup, let me know if I have this right.

Exhaust manifold -> 16g hot side -> hy hot side -> exhaust

hy cold side -> fmic -> 16g cold side -> water/air intercooler -> intake


As for your current setup I love it!! I was always told that water is a terrible idea for a DD but it seems that is not the case, wish I had learned that before, definitely would have taken that route!

Hi Bryan,
I don't actually have the compound setup on it currently (because of converting back to stock ecu/maf to get it running) I will switch back when I can get Link and switch to SD.

BUT it goes like this:

Exhaust manifold -> 16g hot side -> hy hot side -> exhaust

Manifold wastegate Dump to -> exhaust between 16g and HY hot side
Second wastegate -> from between 16g and HY -> atmosphere


Intake -> Hy intake -> Hy cold side out -> 16g inlet -> 16g coldside out -> water to air -> intake mani.

It is a bit to get your head around and people often say that it will destroy the little turbo pushing compressed air into the inlet, but this is the way the diesel guys have been doing it for years.
I believe the DSM stock converter Auto record was just set with a compound setup at the shootout.


The "front mount" is actually the heat exchanger for the water to air setup.
It gives you much more room up front, and a MUCH shorter charge pipe route.

I don't see any downside for the water to air setup, other than there is a pump and liquid involved...
No different than your coolant system, but the pump in this one is electrical, is only 50$ if it fails, and only takes 15min to replace....

Oh wow, all the water to air setups I had seen had small heat exchangers, that one is very impressive. I have some research to do on the water to air setup it seams.
Was looking at this one, looks interesting.

Ahh that is the tri-turbo compound setup on the new BMW diesels isn't it?

I have been trying to figure that out for a bit... pretty complex/crazy.

Little update.
I ditched the megasquirt for good, and got a replacement engine bay harness.

I got an EVO 8 flashable ECU.
I just finished 98% of an adapter harness.

3 times the fun means 3 times the price

And sweet! I've heard of people swapping in the Evo 8 ECU but have never seen it done. Interested to see how it performs.

How does it compare to DSM 99 flashable ECU?

I am not too sure, I am just getting into the flash world. I know the processors are different so you can't use the code/definitions from one another. But it sure seems there is a much bigger community for the EVO ecu's.

Maybe someone's could chime in?

UNREAL!!

So from driving the car a bit during last fall there was too much blow by for my liking. I tore the engine down and got some new rings to tighten up the gap.

I just got her started last weekend, figured I would go play in the snow quick, and run her up the road.
The car is still running on the stock ECU for now, it is a bit rough at idle, but should be good until the rings get seated.

here is another:

Crank the boost up and do some hard pulls. That is all it takes to seat the rings, and is the only method I use now. 10 minutes and I'm done breaking in a motor. No wimpy driving around town till the rings seat BS

Here here.

I beat the piss out of my motor on wastegate boost for the first 50kms, drain the oil, then up to 25psi afterwards for the next 500kms. Drained the oil. Been over 30psi daily ever since.

Nice! I noticed the more you beat the living daylights out of it from the get go, the stronger it is and less oil it consumes

Well heck yes. How do you think we break in fresh diesel engines?

Throw a load in the box and go for a drive.

I am a little scared to crank the boost way up with the 2.4L motor running on stock ecu still. But I guess I will just keep my eye on the wideband. I will take her out on the next semi-dry day.

Bravo!!!!!
Drive it like you stole it and there's 4ks of cocaine in the trunk!!
Btw, use shitty oil as well. No use wasting your money on full synthetic when you're only using it for 50km

Yeah I am a firm believer in dont go with full synthetic for break in. Let that happen with good old fashioned oil then make the switch over. I am at my switch point with my engine 5000 kms and I have had 3 oil changes so far one withing first warm up then dump then one at 2k and next one is soon at 5k then time to make the switch

As my luck would have it, the shitty oil I used in the car for that bit of fun, ended up all over the garage floor over the course of a week, thanks to a not so tight oil drain plug....

Oil change #1 complete

Well, as long as it gets done.
Side note. Does anyone use those magnetic drain plugs?

Update time!

I have the car running on an EVO8 Ecu with Speed Density. Without much issues.
Only 2 issues I have right now:
-No idle controller makes idle, startup, and pushing in the clutch while driving from a high rpm challennging...
-I am simulating the narrowband currently so on a hot start while the wideband is doing its startup, i need to keep my foot on the gas... I will see if my tuner can fix that for me.

I got a pretty VC done by brightside to help with the CC pressure:)



My intake and underhood temps were rediclious... so some turbo blankets were put on.


I took the car to the track for a baseline. Fun being escorted by Bikes


I managed a 13.1 at around 17-18psi. I am having a hell of a time shifting, I am sure I could have touched a 12 as it sat with proper shifting.
I am going to tear apart the clutch hydraulics to see if there are leaks or stuck air and redo the clutch adjustment.

And chilling with another compound turbo dsm after the track


I am also told that my large turbo is restricting my exhaust flow for this setup. And may be contributing to my high intake and underhood temps.
So I bought an hx-35 with a 12cm2 turbine housing, stepping up from the 9cm2 on there currently.



Car is under construction getting that bigger turbo on, waiting on parts.
Meth is working and my tuner wants to start raising the boost. Once it is setup to tell the ECU.
He was talking about map switching and an electric BCS so he could kill the boost and map switch if the meth is not being fired. (pretty cool)
But that is also a work in progress...

Thought I would share my new wheel setup.
Figured I would pull the trigger before going to the Shootout. Always good piece of mind doing a big trip on brand new tires.

17x9 inch 30+ offset
245/45/R17
No spacers

Got a picture from the front mike?

Humm just checked my phone and I don't...
They stick out past the fenders slightly though.

Ok, just curious.

I think my next tires will be 235 45 18, how do you find the sit on the rim, do they poke out a lot?

A +30mm I find this the most you can get away with a 17x9 or 8.5" wide rim, and if they do poke nothing a little camber won't fix.
And if your planing on running a 18x9 or 18x8 a 235/45 will stretch a bit.

Hope that helped a little.

that helps.

I have 18x9 and my 225s stretch a little some I was hoping to get something that didn't

I have maybe 5-6mm of clearance on the inside to the coilover springs, and about the same in the rear before it touches the lower arm.

255/45/17 would have been ideal without any stretch.
I can notice it a little bit on mine, with the 245's but they are a more common tire, incase I get a flat, and I need something in a hurry. And I think I am maxed out for clearance anyways.

225-235's on a 9inch i think is getting into VW territory.

Yeah I think anything lower than what I have now would definitely be there, I find this is ok.

Been a little while. Here is a little update for those with the winter blues..

My trans was super notchy at the end of last season, was really hurting my times. So I decided to start looking for something.

I found an evo 1 trans that seemed to have been ran with the wrong drive. The Centre diff was binding when I took it apart. I got it for a good deal so I am happy that I have the gear sets to work with.





So I was on the hunt for a new centre diff.
I found a steal of a deal and this ended up in my hands the other day.


One question I have for the tranny guys. Can I use a 1990's pinion gear and stubby gear. To convert to the usdm final drive? Or do I need to stick to the 91+??

You should be able to swap in your 90 gear set. I swapped A 95 gear set into my jdm tranny.

Any more of those quaifs? lol...

Nice quaiffe, are you concerned at all about the failures people have with them?

I am super concerned about all these failure stories. But in the searching I did... i didn't find many pictures... and some argue it was actually the 3rd gears breaking and taking it out.
I will see for myself if the stories are true I guess.

Strokers can be hard on these trans; ask Paul Sitarski what bountiful torque has done to his

Will you be going onto the road course with this car? A 4 spider is stronger than a quaife. I want a quaife centre also. I'm thinking of buying on and getting it shotpeened and cryogenically treated to fight against the fracturing.

Ya i am worried about the 2.4's low end torque coupled with the compound turbos...
My tuner was saying he was having to edit cells he has never touched before that my car was hitting.


I hope to do road course with the car. I want it mostly for cruising around, and being able to jump onto a road course or drag strip with little to no changes..

I was actually thinking of getting the unit shot peened and cryo'd. But worried it will void the warranty if it has any. I will have to look into it and see who does that around here..

Unless you are registered to the serial number on the quaife you have no warranty. I did my research on this late last year.

The Evo1 gearset uses the 1990 Intermediate gearshaft. The last thing I would want you to do is drop a 1991+ style Quaife onto a 1990 Style intermediate, and destroy both the center and intermediate. Is the Quaife you got there a 1990 style?

Can't that easily be checked because the gears won't mesh?

Plus I don't believe they made a quaife for 90 gear sets

For a trained hand like mines, I would be able to tell that they don't mesh smoothly. I can almost tell from the pics that the pitch on the Quaife is 91+. They will mesh however and you will be able to bolt it all up in the trans, but it won't spin smoothly. Once bolted all together, spin the trans over with some good force and you will crack all the teeth on the center and intermediate shaft.

Oh sh!t. In all my reading, I never came across that. Odd that they use a 90's part in a 93/4 car. I snapped a pic. Not sure what I got anymore

Quaife, then what came in the transmission, and a 90's unit on the far end.

Mike, it's a mixed year and it's quite possible you have an evo1 with 91+ intermediate shaft. If the center diff in the middle in the above pic is the one that came out of the evo1 trans then it looks like 91+ as I can see a notch in the teeth. Take a closer pic of the center diff and intermediate shaft out of the evo1 trans and I can confirm.

FWIW I have an evo1 gearset sitting in my garage right now and it is all 90 style.

Also, you got steel forks there in the evo1 trans which you would want to use, and in case you did not know it also has the tall 5th gear, same ratio as the evo3 5th.

ok thanks I'll grab more pics.
I do notice on the 90's centre, the tops of the teeth are almost squared off on the top where the quaife and the evo unit have more of a point.

If i do recall, I did read about being a split in the evo1's. One had double syncro second? and the other did not... correct me if I am wrong.

I threw a magnet to the forks and they are steel.
And the longer 5th is the reason I picked this trans up everything else is just bonus.

Yup it is 91+ so your good. Looks like a good gear set. You should be able to drop any gear and ratio from any year trans e.g. double syncro evo 3 gears or single sincro USDM ratios (except 1990) right onto those shafts

If you look at your 1990 center diff you will notice the pitch much thicker.

Thanks a bunch for confirming..... and giving me a 20 minute heart attack.


Another quick question Reza,
When changing the final drive, switching out the pinion gear and the stubby gear on the output shaft to the USDM one. Can I use one from a 1990? (I already have one torn apart)
Or does it need to be a 91+?

You also got the heavy duty rails in there, another bonus Those rails and forks should last the life of your car.

I run the same forks and rails in my trans with an evo3 gearset and a Cusco 4 spider center diff. Just be careful with the evo1 1st gear as it is 16% taller and physically weaker if you plan on throwing a lot of power at it.

Yes you can run the 1990 ring and pinion with no problem. 58 tooth on the ring and 15 teeth on the pinion make it the correct final drive.

Don't swap ring and pinions around though, i.e. try to keep the matching ring to the same pinion that it has been used on.

Awesome, I didn't know about the HD rails or the longer first. I will try to be gentle.


Great, I didnt feel like tearing down another trans to get the ring and pinion out..

Thanks again.

Off the top of my head the 2nd gear is like 0.5% taller and double syncro. 3rd and 4th gear are the same close ratio as the evoIII 3rd and 4th gear, except that the evo1 gears are only single syncro.

If you plan on using that gearset, it would be nice to freshen it up and toss in new syncros on all the gears. Syncros are fairly cheap. I owe you a favor so if you decide to do this, bring me both shafts and some new syncros and I can install them for you in less than an hour.

Wouldn't you want to put a DSM 2nd gear on it so that it becomes a close ratio gear box?

I also like the idea of running a EVO final drive for acceleration. Especially if you plan to rev higher to hold a gear longer on the track. Hard part would be finding an EVO rear ring and pinion.

You can't match a DSM 2nd gear to an Evo1 input shaft. If you want to do this you will lose the evo1 1st gear as well. The evo1 1st and 2nd gear match the evo1 input shaft. Since the evo1 2nd gear is 0.5% taller, you won't even notice the difference between this and a DSM 2nd gear.

If the car was an evo it would make sense to change the final drive, but since we have the leisure of changing the gear ratios without changing the final drive, it's pointless. Both the evo3 3rd and 4th gear and USDM spec 3rd and 4th gear drop right into the trans to match the 91+ center diff without making any other changes.

Why would it be pointless? The final drive on an evo is shorter? It would give better acceleration. Its why they put such an overdrive on 5th?

I'm at work or else I would take the time to do the math!

Mike,
If you want to do it across the board, then sure go through the trouble. With DSM's we can change a single gear ratio instead of the whole final drive in order to achieve what your trying to think about.

Have you even driven a DSM with an evo 3 gearset, and you want to go shorter??? Oh yes right, I forgot you haven't driven a DSM in what, over 10 years!

No wonder your thinking about going shorter than an evo3 gearset. I'm at work too, but I figured this out and already did the math a long long time ago

DSM transmission crap is worthless and obsolete inventory now. Your trying to think something that Shep, TRE, or Jacks would have offered a decade ago, if we did not have such things as evo3 gearsets, and 91+ intermediate shafts which make it easier to change a single gear ratio instead of the complete final drive.

With my Evo X, there is no option to change a single gear ratio, so If I wanted taller or shorter gears, then yes I could easily swap the complete final drive. Although you can, you do not need to do this with a DSM trans.

I'm talking EVOIII gearset with EVOIII final drive in the front and rear with a 97-99 transfer case. Just like an EVO would.

That would make the shortest gearing possible for acceleration.

BTW if final drives is what your after, I have evo1 and evo3 at home Your more than welcome to come take them and do whatever you like with them

Ok you really haven't driven a DSM for a long time. Guys go taller than the USDM 1st gear by going to evo3, and here you are wanting to go shorter.

Bring your tranny by, I'll drop in a 64 tooth evo3 final drive for you, then I'll use your DSM 1st gear, change your rear diff to an evo ring and pinion, and I'll guarantee you'll have a pretty retarded ratio trans for your DSM

Your wanting to go shorter ratio whereas guys complain that the regular DSM 1st and 2nd gear already go by too quick.

I could just picture your DSM pulling through an intersection and your already in 4th gear
Sounds like a truck to me!

I'll take the final drive. Don't need yours now Mike! Hard part is finding the rear ring and pinion to make it work.

It would be the same as driving an EVOIII. Don't think mitsubishi would put "retarded" ratios in there EVO. IT was meant for rally acceleration. I've driven one of those a couple times. It wouldn't be ridiculous at all. Just need to rev higher to hold the gear.

Guys complaining are drag guys that don't want to shift into 5th at the quarter mile. At a track like cayuga road course, shorter gearing would be desired.

A close ratio transmission in a DSM (correct me if i'm wrong)

EVOIII 1st gear
DSM 2nd gear
EVOIII 3rd gear
EVOIII 4th gear
DSM 5th (but put whatever you want as its not used for racing)

That would make 1-4th double synchro.

First gear is pretty pointless in my car there is not enough load to create uber amounts of boost.
But I guess I shift around 7, and dont revv it out like some guys.

Maybe that ratio would be good fora hill climb car!?

You'll want a dsm 1st gear instead of the evo3 if you want to make it closer. I always found the 1st and 2nd gear to be short even on a 14b stockish car. Hey if you want shorter I guess to each his own!

A quick point: the EVO3 1st gear is only single synchro. I had mine machined to accept the 2nd gear double synchro. There is not a lot needed to make it happen aside from the machining.

That's right. Mike already has a double syncro 1st gear that I installed in the 1990 AWD converted to FWD trans that I built him a few months ago.

Now you could give me that trans and I can install the 1990 style Evo1 3rd and 4th gear and a 64 tooth ring gear. You can leave it FWD or find the evo rear diff ring and pinion and achieve your goal.

or

Pull the trans out of the red car that I built and drop in a evo3 3rd and 4th gear, 3-4 rail, 1g 3-4 fork, 64 tooth final drive and have your ultimate close ratio trans with double syncros. Since your going to be hitting 5th gear easily, might as well make that double syncro too, along with the DSM 1st gear

Crazy, Ahhhh!!!

I'll probably leave what i got along for this year. if i do anything to the trans it will be a quaife center and a plated front diff. i don't feel like spending more money on this season on gears.

I still like the idea of putting the EVO final drive in though. I'll keep my eye out for acquiring a rear ring and pinion.

I don't care much about first gear. How often to do actually need to downshift to first? None of the tracks around here require it and I don't autocross. I cringe at the thought of trying to downshift to first.....

Mike, you only rev to 7? What stops you from going higher? Stroker motor? I plan to rev to about 8.5K to have a nice wide powerband with the car.

So you pretty much want to change the final drive just to make 2nd, 3rd and 4th gear rev higher?

Sure sounds good on paper, but I cringe at the thought of your DSM being constantly revved out super high the whole way around Shannonville. I say your car will overheat by the end of the first lap.

I recall Daren Peacock pedalling his 2g around Cayuga last year becasue his coolant temps were getting hot. Sure as hell looked like the DSM couldn't even handle a single all out lap.

Your forgetting it's a DSM. I say you actually get it out on the track and see how the car likes the current setup before keeping the car revved near 8.5k for 2-3 km straight.

If it were me, I'd keep the gear ratio as is, and keep a smaller turbo, which makes more power under the curve, and stay in a gear longer rather than constantly revving the car high and shifting through several gears because you want it to behave like an evo3. Will the car weigh ~2500lbs as well like an evo3?

I'm almost confident you'll have overheating problems as is. I've seen it enough already. Just trying to be realistic here. This is not Gran Turismo, lol.

I want to change 2nd, 3rd and 4th to accelerate at a higher rate and i want to rev high so I can hold a gear and still make power. This might potentially save a gear change up to fourth and then downshift to 3rd into the corner while instead i can just hold third and rev it out for that one corner so i don't upside the balance of the car with 2 gear changes. Or inversely chug down low in 4th at mosport and still have acceleration.

I'm confident I will have overheating issues as well. Big rad and a hood with a bunch of holes is the start of the strategy.

I was impressed with Daren's car though. His temps crept up but he could still stay in it for a 20min session and he doesn't even have an oil cooler yet. Daren could have showed up to that lapping day and gone out for 8 20min sessions and never popped his hood to do anything if he wanted. A testament to a well built and sorted car. Now he just has to get it to turn and learn how to drive lol.

Ummmm no offence but, I saw EVERY car on the track that day pass both you in your Mini and Darren's DSM.

I guess if impress means to just be able to pedal the car around the track, my 1g could do that all day too

Sorry but the DSM looked like it was on a Sunday drive to the grocery store. I'm just being honest here. Props for taking the DSM lapping, but it definately did not impress me at all

Now lay in it full for 20 minutes straight, then that'll impress me. I saw none of that.

Says the guy that never driven around a road course

Money where your mouth is Reza!!
Show up with your EVO or DSM to Cayuga's road course and i gladly go up against you in my Mini or once the DSM is completed. That sound confident to you? My 150whp FWD vs either of your 300hp plus AWD cars. That is how confident I am that I can out drive you.

Note: Reza and I are friends and push each others buttons

I'll fly to Ontario to see this

Lol no thanks Mike!

Let me mention it again. That day I saw EVERY SINGLE car out there pass both of you guys, even a Honda Civic! You were definately driving the crap out of your Mini, and it can take it, but your driving is very inconsistent.

Now the DSM I can understand was overheating, but the Mini has no excuse.

I'm pretty sure I pointed out every car that passed you while I was riding passenger.
Now don't tell me your car just happened to be the slowest one out there that day

I know you wish your name was Mike Schumacher, but its not. Your Mike @ brightside, the powdercoating guy

Lmfao!!! Miss you guys! Lolll

But he wont take the challenge....Say what you want but you didn't even stay the entire day....I don't remember everyone passing me but that is a game of he said, she said. Of course people are going to pass. Civic pass me on R-comps? yup that happened. The mini doesn't have the power against most other guys out with me. Driving is everything, mods and the car mean very little if you can't use them.

I'll quote Reza that day "Bet i'd be pretty good at this. I'm good at Gran Turismo" lol

Talk is cheap. I'm willing to go right up against you with a car with twice the driving wheels and twice the power. That's my confidence. I want to point at you being passed by the civic!

Take the challenge come on! Talk is cheap!

hahahah nice to see everyone chatty again!



I don't think they recommend to rev a 2.4 much higher than 7.5k, although many people have told me if the bottom end was done correctly, there should be no issues going higher.

My car also makes over 20psi of boost before 3000rpm. I will be content with keeping it under 7.5k for the extent of it's life with all the low end power.


My car also overheats at 3000rpm going down the highway... I'm sure the half rad and extra exhaust piping doesn't help. But best of luck to you holding high rpms constantly! It will be a battle!
I am seriously considering rad's in the front bumper/fenderwell to compensate so I can even finish one lap on a road course.

Get a full rad in there ASAP. Do some cutting and put it on an angle or something along those lines. Half rads are for drag cars.

WOOT... I'm willing to start a pool for who wins! Both are great guys! Oh and I'm a master at Gran Turismo too! LOL.
Cheers

Bets on! Who wins...

Mike ___

Reza ___

Patiently awaiting Reza's reply....

Reza's crazy fast in Forza btw, I'm sure he'd spank that lil mini!

Ha you guys are funny! Nice to see you active again Kevin, keep it that way

Mike after seeing what your tires look like after a day of lapping, you know very well I won't be taking any of my cars for such a beating. Plus, Evo X vs Mini is not a fair match.

I'll take you up on the offer in your Mini though and you can ride shotgun Other than that, I guess we can play Forza? Atleast you won't have to worry about overheating!

BOOOOOOOO!!!!

Your not driving my car on the track. Nobody does. That's like asking to sleep with my girlfriend.

I don't play video games. I do the real thing!

Opps I should have asked then! Sorry... LOL
Cheers

I think mine did 20 mins straight at points. I will not vouch for running cool. I definitely didnt care about blowing it up that day. The stock guage didnt look happy, but I drove home just as well somehow.
Damn you guys are getting me excited. Better get back in the garage today. Damn job hunting is distracting and depressing. I ll be in on a race with you crazy bunch haha. See if I can at least trailer it this year. Reliable cooling system definitely needs thought though. Big rad, vents, oil cooler should help.

So after getting this sweet transmission together. I leaned on the flywheel by accident and the entire rotating assembly moved.

Pulled the thrust bearing/cap. Sure enough my 2.4L 6bolt has crank walked...

Don't think I will be putting anymore $$ into this thing.

Sad day, Was nice knowing you all

So after getting this sweet transmission together. I leaned on the flywheel by accident and the entire rotating assembly moved.

Pulled the thrust bearing/cap. Sure enough my 2.4L 6bolt has crank walked...

Don't think I will be putting anymore $$ into this thing.

Sad day, Was nice knowing you all

Truly a sad day indeed, take a break but don't give up, I really wanted to see this compound turbo setup run at full tilt.

Did it get all the way through or is it just a bearing change away from being back to good health?

It's not all the way through, but the crank touched the bearing cap... not sure I'd want to just throw new bearings in or not...

sh!t Mike sorry to hear that, don't give up now though!!

I'm back b$*ches!


I had a low km motor dropped off 24hrs after I found out my car walked.
it was from a car a buddy and I parted out almost 9 years ago.
106$ in gaskets. And she was back on the road with near perfect compression!!

Have an idle controller back in it and just working on cruise control!
I drove it to work today and the Evo 3 5th gear is pretty awesome on the highway.


I have also started powdercoating on the side. Figured I'd start practicing on my own parts first.




See you's at some meets and the shootout!

Glad to hear it Mike

I had a feeling a little crankwalk wouldn't throw you out of the game

Return of Sassy with Version 2.0 of the compound turbos.

Nice. I like the "yeller"!!!

Ghislain

Wicked! Glad to see your back in compound mode!

DAMMNN Fine

And your taking it for the long drive to ohio?

Heck ya!
It's already been down there 2 years ago with the compounds
Only Problem I had was the car idling on the big slope at the border, it started to burn a bit of oil because of the angle the turbo had to stay sitting at. That should be fixed now..

I made some changes to the piping to relieve the backpressure issues I was having. I will be utilizing the internal gate on the small turbo dumping under full boost aswell as the wastegate for the large turbo dumping at full boost.
3 wastegates whaaat!?

And yes I will try racing again... between the little sleep and rediclious amount of beer.

Very nice! I experienced compound turbos in RX7 and really liked it. It spooled to 10psi by 2000rpm & at about 4500 secondary larger turbo kicked-in with a slight hiccup in the transition.

Do you have spool-up log from Ver 1.0? Assuming you are on ECMLink.

^^^ that sounds more like a sequential setup which is really common on RX7s, not a compound. There is no 'switch over' point with compounds as one is feeding compressed air to the other, so they are both used at the same time.

Kevin's got it.
I believe the fd3 RX7's come stock with sequential turbos.

Compounds feel more linear once they are setup correctly.
When I had the small turbo set on stock wastegate pressure and the large turbo set around 20ish, the small one spooled instantly, then there was a bit of lag, then the larger one started screaming and kicking in, which was cool, but not ideal.

You want both of them working in their efficient range, and the boost patterns to overlap.

My tuner said that he was having to edit parts of the VE table that he never had to pay this much attention to, or sometimes ever edit.

I am running evo8 ecu with ecu flash and evoscan.
I can try and find an old log though. I believe it was 20psi before 3000.

Here is a very early log. I think this was the first day we got it spiking to 20psi. Boost was a little erratic, and I had some high IAT issues, but you get the idea.
I know I have a more refined one somewhere...

http://www.datazap.me/u/sp1ke/20psi...data=6-11-15-17&solo=6&mark=2631

That is correct...thanks for clearing that up. Also, i am not a turbo guru so i only judge based on my own real life experience.



I like the idea of sequential setup so all available exhaust pressure can be used to spool-up small turbo at low rpms (at least 2000). However, the transition point (when bigger turbo takes over the small) felt like a weak spot because boost noticeably dropped in rx7. Based on your comments, the compound setup don't drop boost since both turbos are always online. However, there should be some trade off in early spool? I can't find boost in your log? TPS peaks only at 82%? you didn't gun her all the way?

300zx uses compound setup consisting of dual Garret T25s. Each per 3 cylinders on V6 3.0. Stock boost at 9.5 PSI and takes about 3000rpm to get there according to local 300zx owner.

You will have to check Load and convert the KPA to PSI. and doesn't look like my tps was calibrated in that log. Looks like it was taking until 3300ish to hit 20psi in this one. I'll try and find a more refined one.

The compounds actually assist in earlier spool, I never thought of it until I switched from my 16g to the compound setup. I was actually beginning to spool earlier than I did with the single small turbo.
if you have ever taken off the compressor outlet while the car is idling, you can feel the air slightly pushing out of the turbo. So with the large turbo feeding into the smaller turbo's inlet, you can just picture the advantage this has.

I know I have better performing logs somewhere. and the one did 20psi at 2950rpm.
But here's the summary of this old one. I'm sure if the boost controller wasn't trying to open the wastegates, there wouldn't be the boost taper around the 20psi mark.

2480=0psi
2847= 10.5ish
3125=18.3

2500=0psi
2855=10psi
3136= 19.8psi

That's just a standard twin-turbo setup. V-engine, put one turbo per cylinder bank. Neither turbo feeds into the other.

A VERY basic breakdown:

Twin-turbo: two identical turbos which do not interact with each other.

Sequential turbos: two different sized turbos which also do not do much to interact with each other, but have different powerbands and therefore help the car to have a wider power band.

Compound turbos: two different sized turbos which have their hot sides integrated, AND their cold sides integrated. The purpose is similar to sequential turbos. It does a better job, but is more complicated to setup and tune.

Keep at 'er, Mike

Thanks for doing conversions. 10.5 at 2847 seems on the high side. I was hopping at least 2500. When i get home i'll compare to my e316g log.

Factory turbo on EVO-X starts to come alive at about 2500rpm. Mivec (variable exhaust/intake) defiantly helps with early spool..

Do you have detailed pics of all the piping between both turbos?

I was just thinking about that being on the low side, I think we were doing tip-in tuning on this run.
If you look at the TPS I didn't start pressing the throttle down until about 2200rpm... So I guess the start points I listed above aren't something to pay attention to as I wasn't full throttle even till close to 3k...

Clear as day Jeremy. I guess one could also do combinations. Twin compound turbos or quads. I also heard of rear mounted Squires turbo which apparently smog legal in Cali. Endless possibilities.

Yes i saw that, i would even start at 2000rpm 3rd gear pull which is what recommended by Thomas at Ecmlink

There's a diesel truck out there with quad turbos feeding twin superchargers

Edit: Sorry Mike, I'll stop destroying your thread....

I think someone needs to but this diesel guy a book on thermo dynamics...

He seems to know what he's doing

have seen the 8 turbo 57 chevy??????

Here are my logs as promised.
I only get 4.2 psi at 2800 starting from 2000.


21 psi at 4200-4440


Your number are pretty good compared to mine.
Did you log it on 2.4 displacement?

Alex, why so rich with so little timing? It's definitely hurting performance!

FWIW a rich mixture requires more timing to ensure a complete burn. You are killing both efficiency and power by running like that. Judging by your 2 screen shots, timing is far from optimal. I'm curious as to where your timing is by 7K

The pull was done on stock DSM timing map and EVO stock fuel map. The goal was to iron out FPR problem so my wideband lines up with AFRationEST/Fuel table like it did with my stock FPR. I had bad luck so far with Aeromotive FPR.

The log at 4200rpm:
wideband : 10:0
AFRationEST : 10.1

2800:
wideband : 13:5
AFRationEST : 13.7

I latter updated fuel maps to about 10.9 - 11.2.


Should be around 15 degrees. I dropped it by a degree from stock. Shortly after i downgraded to factory oem exhaust and dropped boost to 16psi. This was right before i drove my DSM to LA.

Kev, i would love to study your log. Can you email one to miles556@hotmail.com ? No meth just pump fuel.

Slowly but surely.
Its been hard working on the car at my new place while all my parts are somewhere else. But I am getting there.

Also have an announcement that will probably blow your minds.
I'll save that for a new thread, once the car is running again.

She is looking really good!
240z fender flares?

Thanks

I think that's what they called them... not sure.
I just searched around for ones with correct measurements. And these ended up at my door

First drive
https://instagram.com/p/2rzrRFJfTs/

wow mike absolute monster! keep it up

Spooling turbo sound

Dude that thing sounds mad!!

Sounds like I'm on a bus with headphones on. HAHAHAHAHA


Sounds mean man, good stuff!

More pics. I'm still working some bugs out and waiting on my new front suspension setup.

Car is impossible to launch with the 245 tires and evo 1st gear.
I will be looking at setting up my 2step very soon.

Enjoy!

https://instagram.com/p/3OzT6BJfS4/?taken-by=kuttzy
https://instagram.com/p/3h-ZsbJfcf/?taken-by=kuttzy

Let me be the first to say, GODDAMN!

Nice work she looks good! What is your suspension setup going to be?

Very clean install of the fender flares. Lookin' pretty good there bud!

Thanks guys



I was talking with Peter at Hotbits. Pretty sure I will be going with a DT1 setup from him. We were doing some measurements last night.
I will be sticking with the Koni rear's for now, as the fronts will already be breaking the bank.

Is that the original paint on the car?

Paint has been redone at some point in its life. Up close it really needs a cut and buff. But it looks awesome from 10 ft away, and in pics.

You need to do something about that dirty, bent to heck front plate................Like throw it in the back seat

Nice car!

Thx braaa.

The cops don't like that the last 3 times I got pulled over.

I have a "cleanawd" license plate to go on, but I don't think it's up to that status yet.

Looks killer in person for that matter, definitely beats it since the last time I saw it with that measly 14b in there .

Love it man

Very well done, I like how the spoiler integrates with the front bumper.

Someone found me at cscs. Nice shot

https://instagram.com/p/4xXFjQDQcb/

That "turbo" you have written on the back, you should instead get one that says "turbo²"

+1 on the nice shot!

Car looked nice at cscs, I was actually impressed with the number of DSMs there this time.

Your welcome I'll send the compliments to my wife!

I haven't posted much lately.

I picked up a set of hotbits dt-2 front coilovers.
https://instagram.com/p/5DJBClJfdR/?taken-by=kuttzy

And here is one of my fav shots from the shootout while doing autocross.
https://instagram.com/p/6RFUClpfQZ/?taken-by=kuttzy

And a couple others:




The car of course acted up as soon as I got there.

I tried the test and tune drags on the Friday at the shootout. During the drags the larger turbo was not hitting full boost until after 6000rpm, and 3rd gear started grinding. Something was defiantly wrong, so after two test and tune runs I gave up and did not signup for drags the next day, but I still hit my best time of 12.4.

Reza popped by the Canadian tent the next day and pointed out to me that I had the wrong selector arm on my transmission. (friggen guru)

Autocross was still possible, who needs 30psi going around corners!? I just turned off the large turbo....
BUT, I tried to do the power steering cutout fix a couple days before the shootout. This lead to a leaking oring while I was autocrossing, steering was impossible so I gave up after 4 runs.


I just tore into the car this week, and found out the internal flapper on the small turbo is leaking exhaust even at idle.... so I found my spool issue

I wanna see this puppy run now!

Reza to the rescue, *cue hero music*

Mike I think your car is my favorite one to watch, just because it looks damn good and the wicked setup you have under the hood.
I can't wait to see the thing in person! Keep us updated on your progress!

Are the hood vents new?

If so, did you notice much improvement when you put them in?

Yeah it's new he was originally looking for a VIS hood but after I saw yours I suggested he do the cutout thing like you have.

Also curious to hear if you noticed a big improvement

Does your car have brake ducting? If not, what are the pipes on the right side of the front bumper there?

Thanks!, I will try and post more


They are new, I got them like 5 days before the shootout as an attempt to help my cooling issue. I honestly didn't notice a difference in the coolant temps. I have irregular overheating issues still. But I'm sure they help to some extent.




Those are just a desperate attempt at helping to cool the car. They direct air to the rad.

I remember looking in your bay when you had the hood up at the plantation, my eyes glazed over, then I walked away chugging my beer.

LOL

Had no idea what was going on in there, but I knew it was good. HAHA

Haha, ya it is quite the Frankenstein. Not exactly your typical setup.

But it's only good if it works!
Damn thing should be able to drop 11's with ease, but I'm still half a second away from that...

But you just figured it out. You had a leak, bam!, done, now hit the track and let's see this.

Well for those that don't have me on instagram, I went to the track a few weeks back chasing the 11. And the car was knocking like a horny hooker at my door...

I stayed in it on the one pass and this was the result... the stock head gasket bolted down with l19's was in perfect shape to my surprise.

[img:center]https://instagram.com/p/76GBb3JfTN/[/img]


I have another stock motor ready to be dropped in, hopefully grab that 11 before winter, and should be bringing back the 2.4l for next season.

Cheers!

Plopped the engine in last night.
First engine swap I did without a tractor and forks.

https://instagram.com/p/8DfL_fpfXm/

heres some legit links,

Melted piston, OEM head gasket with L19's was in immaculate shape.


New doner engine, completely stock 72k motor. Brought back to life after sitting for 9 years.


Thanksgiving day, I drove the car an hour to my family dinner.
Car started smoking again, I thought OHH crap this motor is junk too. Turns out my big turbo died on me. A new turbo was picked up ON Thanksgiving and had me back on the road.


Then what do you do when you get your first snowfall, and your daily driver has low profile summer tires on... Take the awdracecar





And with all the nice weather I have been dailying the car, and playing with the tune, leaning out the car more and more. boosting great, meth with map switching is my new fav mod

Hey Mike you switch maps manually or you using a controller that sense pressure in the line to do this automatically?

She looks beautiful!!

look good and great progress Mike

Thanks Bryan and Alex.

I switch automatically, I have a pressure switch that activates the pump relay around 15is psi. Then a trigger wire off the pump's power that runs to a small hobbybox/circuit to drop to 5v for the evo 8 ecu and an LED on my steering column so I know everything is working. There is no float saftey or flow sensor... but maybe I will work on that down the road.

If I don't want to spray meth I can just disconnect the pressure switch and it will use the normal maps.

Setup something like this here for those interested:
http://evoecu.logic.net/images/4/45/ADC-evo8-harness.jpg

So this is what tells the ecu to use the meth map?

Yes sir.
A flow sensor would be ideal and more safe. But this works for now.

Cool! Very cool! Hoping link can do something similar.

Link will switch maps when the EGR or FP solinoids are active. So if you are running the Meth pump with your egr valve... It will change maps accordingly.

Now mike. With Link, the EGR solinoid /meth relay.. Can be programmed to de activate at any count of knock. There for instantly changing the map back to something more conservative. So if anything goes wrong with the meth set up.. Clog, leak, empty tank... As soon as the car knocks.. It can pull timing and add lots of fuel. Can you do that with the evo Ecu?

Also with the DSMap set up. I believe they actually used a electric 5v pressure sensor on the meth hose. Warewolf could take the voltage and react to anything under or over spacific meth pressures and alter the tune to save it. I have not found away for link to do this with its limited input control.. But maybe then evo ecu might be able.

If you know what Im talking about.. Lal

I'm pretty sure if it knocks above the setpoint, it will switch back to the regular low octane maps. I'd have to look into it to be sure though.

Also if I was using EBC via the ecu, it will also cut the boost.

I've been really busy to update this. but now that the season is ending I figure I will throw up some pics.

I had my transmission apart to double check my rebuild, and figured I would powdercoat it while it was out.



I also rebuilt my powersteering pump modified the highrpm cut out, and powdercoated.


One of my issues was airflow to the half rad, and fitment of the heat exchanger with the large turbo in the way. So My buddy got a Tig welder and shortening the heat exchanger was his first job.... god it was scary. But I was able to fit the exchanger much easier and angle it so that my rad could get some fresh air (Helped lots on autocross)





Another thing I wanted done in preparation for the shootout was to correct my roll centre and bump steer.
I ordered some QA1 balljoints and a Drake Mustang bump steer correction kit. The sleeve for the balljoint had to be welded to the stock arm. And the drake tie rod ends still required me to shorten the tie rods.

Picture of the car sitting pretty before the shootout. Oil and power steering coolers added.


Picture of me whipping around the autocross at the shootout.


Sunset at the Plantation. (thanks Jason Drew!)


The car handled well at the autocross, I really wish I had the rear toe eliminator in the car, but that will be on the list for next year...
I still have yet to get any solid drag passes. Last shootout I left with a 12.4@118 missing 3rd twice.
This year I only managed a 12.6@112? poopy launch and at 27psi as my intercooler pipes kept blowing off. I'm still convinced the car has an 11 second pass in it.


Here's a broken 3 bolt axle... I am able to launch the car around 20psi with the compounds. The axle rejected that. I have since switched to a 4bolt.



And the lovely engine bay shot


Next year I am going to upgrade the tiny water intercooler. and possibly switch to meth injection on each runner, as well as in between charges.

I've had weird issues with the boost building slowly after 22ish psi. I've been talking to Kevin Jewer, and he is having me look into a couple things.

I am also looking for a 6bolt 100mm crank to bring my 2.4L motor back into play.

That's some wicked work, love the steering mods!!
How much lower will this drop your roll center? Have you driven lots with the new setup? How's it feel?

I didn't measure after doing the balljoint. But I remember measuring the stock height vs how much I dropped the car. I ended up getting the longest shank (interchangeable lengths)

It is honestly night and day. Feels like I can just point the wheel and it doesn't fight back. I especially noticed in the round abouts.

Nice work Mike! You and I both know how much work goes into coating a transmission case lol.

Thanks!

Ya I don't even wanna know how much work went into yours. Mine looks like a dog's breakfast compared to yours... and I had a bunch of work into it.

Such awesome work. She looks sexy and mean as hell!

I think now that you've gotten a lot of the important work out of the way, you'll be able to spend more time racing. A bit more seat time launching, and once you figure out your boost issue that thing will dig deep into the 11's.

I'm excited to see it happen

I am more excited to see a 1g that can actually turn!!

Love following your build Mike, you always keep it unique!

Thanks!

I hope to drive it a lot more.
I really wanted the 11 sec timeslip on a bone stock engine. But oh well.

I think one of the biggest issues was the IAT's I was seeing 160F at times. The little core doesn't keep up I think.

Now with the cooler weather it feels like I've picked up 100hp.

And I don't know if you call it 'actually turning'.... my lowered Volvo handles a tonne better than this thing... but at least I am making this dinosaur a bit more predictable.

160's are very high, I ran into knock issues when I peaked at 156F. I'm very lacking in the fmic department at this power level. All my friends around here just say oh just turn the boost down a little, they don't understand it doesn't work that way lol.

Have you guys looked into spraying water pre turbo or pre intercooler.

I'm not interested in spraying pre-turbo, seen some compressor wheels damaged by that.

I'm just going to get the ETS 4" core and roll with that.

I am thinking about spraying the smallest nozzle possible in between charges. its suppose to help a lot... But I'm also scared about compressor damage like Jason said. I just hope if I spray it in the pipe and not at the compressor, it would evaporate completely...

I think if you do the setup where you use a solenoid you would minimize the risk, that way when you start spray you can ensure the line is at full pressure and you get nice atomization

If I'm not mistaken most guys who spray pre-turbo also use more water than meth, as the meth is corrosive to aluminum.

Yeah usually pre turbo is just water, no meth

Sounds like another way to overcomplicate an already complicated setup. Sometimes less is more. Pre-turbo water injection, I think anybody that's done it can agree, isn't needed for your 11 second goal. Seems more like a bandaid fix for running out of intercooler.

^^
Sometimes I need to hear this and stop being a dreamer.
Intercooler first it is

So It's been awhile.
Couple things I've been up to.
I've adapted the 3kgt rear trailing arms to my car for over all 2" wider track width, internal drum ebrakes and larger rear rotors. (I am still looking for 2g 3kgt OR EVO 8/9 rear calipers)
Machine work:

Almost assembled powdercoated almost everything:



All assembled and tested now driving around.
It may be placebo effect, but a mix of the wider track new carrier bearings, rear toe delete and solid subframe bushings, but sure feels like this car turns 9000x gooder.




I also was able to find a 100mm 6bolt (2.4L) crank for my motor that died years ago. I found out it was the topline oilpump that shat the bed.

So I began tearing into the motor, have the head apart for porting and upgrades.



I took the motor to a friend whos done his fair share of motor builds on these cars, and we knocked out the bottom end in an afternoon. Plastigauge came out great, and cleaned up any imperfections.




While waiting on the head to be ported, I believe I have found a way to use the 4piston 3kgt front brakes without brackets and matching the rear track width.
I will update once complete.

Goal is to have the car tested and be competitive in autocross and 11.5 bracket at this years shootout!

Very cool!! Look forward to more updates!

That is some seriously awesome work, Mike. She's looking great!

Sorry to hear your Topline pump failed on you It does make me glad I decided to sell one of my kidneys to get an OEM front cover when I built my engine. What did you decide on for the new build?

Thanks!


I am going to re-use an OEM pump from a motor I have with around 130k on it.


I actually remember the distinct sound it was making at idle. It was a "Woo Wooo Wooo" sound, kind of similar to wind blowing through a tunnel/tube.
Someone told me it was how they cut the gears differently on the topline unit that made that sound, so I completely ignored it. grr

Damn that would fracking piss me off. Does Topline cover anything like that?

I doubt it, especially with the balance shafts removed.[

Here is the carnage for those interested.
I actually got pissed off however many years it was, and stuffed the engine in a corner.
It wasn't until this winter that I actually cracked it all open.

Looks like this guy had the SAME wear marks on his parts:
http://www.dsmtalk.com/forums/showthread.php?t=205214

Ouch! OEM is the only way to go on the pump, seen it time and time again.

Make sure to toss in straight cut gears with the BSE.