FMIC on stock T25

Read on dsmtuners that it is pointless to hook up a FMIC (i have a mishimoto m series) to my stock T25 setup as it will hinder my performance more so than the state it is currently in...any ideas? Should i not be looking to drop money on the piping and put the FMIC install on the back burner until i get a bigger turbo?

Why not upgrade the turbo while upgrading the intercooler? Even so much as just a T-28 or a 14b.

I'm scared of damaging the engine without doing some internal work. And i would think upgrading the turbo will open a can of worms as far as needing to upgrade fuel pump, injectors and so on.

Correct me if im wrong

Just do a small 16g. They're a TON of fun for little money!

don't expect to see any hp gains from installing a FMIC with the t-25.

you should be able to get a 14b for less then $100 and an install kit for around the same price, the 14b will not need any additional support mods and is a great upgrade over the t-25.

Once you've done the install kit for the 14b...swapping to any 16g will be simple when you are ready to buy support mods.

No can of worms. Just dsmlink, wideband, boost gauge, fuel pump + rewire, exhaust, plugs + wires, injectors and you're golden.

I've beat as hard as I can on my stock block 7 bolt all summer long with an hx35.

Also, if you haven't yet, setup your clutch so that you don't need to push it in to start your car. It will help save your bearings.

If you're on a 5 speed that is.

He doesn't even need any of the above to switch to a 14b. All he needs is the 'install kit', a working 14b and he's done.

You make it sound too easy Stephan

All kidding aside that will definitely be a mini project I will begin once:

a) i get some money
b) clutch is replaced (maybe even an awd swap beforehand)

Unless Salomon is right?

Loving the support and feedback of this forum...you guys rock!

Salomon is right!!! All the extra's would certainly help... but are not necessary to swap on a 14b.

Sorry. Those supporting mods are for a 16g and up.

Salomon is right. 14b, easy-peasy.

Once you get the hang of working on these cars, it is easy. Just take your time and do things right.

Patience is a virtue a guess, as i learned with the alternator pull/install when i rebuilt it. Did get frustrated at times but it is ofcourse a smaller car inwhich the dsm gods packed a big punch in that small package

The indestructible alternator never made for our cars came from the Saturn 90amp. Seriously.

Most of us are using one and have relocated it using the JAY RACING RELO KIT to the back of the motor, away from the turbo and downpipe (heat).

You're going to have a lot of fun learning about your car, if you're a TRUE enthusiast. And by the sounds of it, you are! Glad to see another one of "us" here

sh!t I wish i had read up on here prior to rebuilding, but hey for 100$ everything said and done i dont think i can complain.

And thanks Mike, i think...not to sure if its an honor to be on of "us" or not jokes...appreciate the warm welcome

Swap to a 14b when you're doing your FMIC if you want to see some gains. Or even before.. it's up to you. It's a factory turbo; there are no supporting mods required.

The list that Stephan gave you is a good list to work on over the next while. Most can be done one at a time, when you have the time and money available. Once the list is complete, you're ready to hop into a 16g. Those little things pack a punch; they'll keep you happy for a while.

If your alternator goes again, you may want to look into a Saturn alternator. If it was rebuilt well, you probably won't have any issues with it for a while. I wouldn't worry about it.

Oh, and you bought a DSM for a reason. You're a long, long ways away from needing to upgrade any engine internals

For the 14b, all you need is the turbo and the 1g oil feed line from the head 1g drain line(2g will work too with a slight mod) and your coolant lines off the T-25. Also a manual boost controller so you don't boost too much and hit fuel cut.

If your motor is somewhat healthy, it'll be just fine. I'm stock 7 bolt block on an FP Red running 11's @ 115+

Dont worry bout the turbo... unless you have a 14b or 16g given to ya for a few bucks. $200 for the 14b and install kit, would be better spent on upgrades and prep for a bigger turbo. You will end up going bigger anyway.

I would grab everything else you will need, like injectors, wideband, tuning devices..fuel pump upgrades... get everything working on the car and learn how to use it..

Then upgrade to any turbo you want. If your not used to 400hp cars.. then grab a td05 size turbo.. more then 450hp is your goal?? then go with a large frame turbo. By then you will know how to tune it.. and the car will be ready.

my 2 cents

To keep in mind, your stock 2g BOV will leak any boost higher than 12psi.

I ran 14b@15 psi on completely stock setup(except BOV). It's a night and day compared to t25.

I have managed to get 13.7sec@99.5mph out of the stock turbo at 17psi with fmic and other supporting mods, the car worked very well. Also with the same setup other then swapping to very used evo16g the car went 12.7 with stock exhaust. So yes the stock turbo is weak but on a street you get an instant response. I have ported my a lot on the cold/hot side.

Awesome feedback... @Jay Stacey power goals will be around 300+HP, my brother has a supercharged range rover sport and that kind of power in a lighter dsm would be more than enough for me.

@Alex the previous owner had installed a greddy type s bov

@Paul that is what i like about the stock t25 the faster spool/response but then at higher rpm i feel as if the car is being choked...but then again i only take it to higher rpm's when a fart can ricer needs to be brought back down to reality

One of us.... One of us.... One of us.....

The type S is a solid unit that should carry you for a while now. Is it recirculated? If not, you should look into doing that. Pool hose from Home Depot works very well as its quite flexible. Ribbed black with a blue stripe.

A 14b will be a lot of fun for you if you're just getting into the scene. It will also give you a taste for getting under the hood and turning some wrenches. As already mentioned, you don't need any other mods to support that turbo, but a boost controller might be advisable.



Just like that eh? . you're looking at 1300$ + for all of that and a solid days work for a seasoned DSMer. But all of those are pretty necessary for anything beyond a 14b/t28.
I'd also ad an oil pressure gauge, upgraded clutch, and FIMC.
Plus, when you go bigger your rad fans become an issue.

Take a peek at the upgrade path on tuners. It should give you a pretty good idea of what you'll require and when.

Cheers and welcome! Oneofus...... Oneofus..... Oneofus...... Dammit, can't turn that thing off...

are you sure stock fans become an issue? or you mean stock rad?

Both I suppose. Stock rad because of its limited cooling capacity, and rad fans because of their size. The stock fans will out perform any slim fan, hands down.
Bigger rad doesn't work well with big fans

A FMIC is probably one of the most underrated mods on a DSM. Everybody is so focused on getting an exhaust, BOV, intake, etc. If you've ever been in a stock SMIC DSM and then in the exact same car, unchanged other than a nice FMIC, it feels like a completely different car.

Not saying it's wise to do on a T25. But I can't be bothered owning such a turbo. However, anything 14B and larger it will be a nice increase.

I would fine a small 16G to replace the T25. It's again, a turbo that's often overlooked. It's not as great as the infamous Evo III 16G, but while everybody is searching for one of those, you can get a s16G for not a lot more than a 14B. And it's better overall. Spools just about as quick, but packs a much harder punch.

I would do a s16G with the FMIC. Toss a Walbro 255 in the tank and rewire it, and keep it around 15 psi. The car will feel like a monster compared to the way it is now

Wow, gone are the days of free mods and being happy with a few more psi on a stock turbo

I would say get what you can out of the T25 while installing the mods that you'll need/are compatible with any turbo. When the T25 is boring and only then, start building from its replacement outward.

To answer the original question, I think you will get more out of the T25 with a FMIC but it might be a waste to plumb it in because you'll outgrow the turbo.

I run the mishimoto rad with the 2 stock fans (rad and a/c) wired to come on together and it works flawlessly, as for clearence, I have the vrsf j pipe, e316g and the HAFE manifold. Everything fits nicely.

Lucian, I can't agree with you on that one.
After we installed the FMIC and the 16g I barely noticed a difference, maybe if I had done some tuning I would have. The car only became a whole different monster after the 3" exhaust went on.
Maybe it was because it had been a few days since I drove it last, but overall the exhaust was the change that turned my car into a monster.

^^^
Did you turn the boost up? Were you running much boost in the first place?

Nope, I think I was at 11psi the whole time. or I went from 7 to 11, i don't recall

I've noticed the FMIC on multiple DSMs, regardless of my own or somebody elses. Just personal feel I guess. Exhaust is noticeable too of course. Hell I noticed a difference between cat and no cat, both on a 3" exhaust

Hm that's pretty impressive, I figured you wouldn't make a huge difference between cat and no cat, at least not noticeable.

Im sure if you were running your little t25 over 15psi (when she becomes a hair dryer) a fmic would help some but Mannys money could be used twords better mods that will actually help more in his stock form. I say... RtM MBC and boost guage would be my first mods.

I also noticed a difference between cat and no cat on my 3inch, not much... But a difference.

At 11 psi I don't think there is much cooling difference between the SMIC and FMIC because the air just isn't that hot in the first place. If you overrun the SMIC, then installing the FMIC will surely make a difference. The T25 will run hotter for the same psi so arguably the FMIC is a better mod on the smaller turbo

I guess if you were smart about plumbing it with future turbo in mind it'd be worth more than a doorstop for now.

With all information in this thread, Manny is gonna end up building a sh!t box of a DSM!

Take Lucian's advice. A FMIC is the most underrated mod. I just can't see how a FMIC will NOT make a difference. A big 4" Garrett core would compliment any 14b or T25 size hairdryer....

Also, you don't need a bigger rad, and you don't need to relocate your alternator to the back of your motor. It is a true pain in the butt to work on. I have had all my 1g DSM's with no heatshields on the 02 housing and alternators in the OEM location with no problems whatsoever. I must be doing something right if I have ran my alternators in the OEM location since 1997 on several DSM's with no issues. Only time I ever killed one was from accidently shorting it out with a wrench or getting water or fluid splashed into it.

Anyways carry on..... time to pull out my popcorn

@ Reza. Wouldn't spending money on making the fmic work with the t25 be a waste of time/money when it will no doubt be swapped out in the near future? Are you sudgesting Mannys first mod be a fmic or am I completely out to lunch?

Isn't that what you posted? I'm not talking about his first mods. A few of you guys give bad advice in general. Just my humble opinion

I would definately get the biggest baddest FMIC once and never again, even on a T-25 turbo car. He's gonna mod the car, he's gonna upgrade the turbo and FMIC. Might as well do it once, do it right!

Yep.. Thats what I posted. I apologize for giving bad advice based on what my personal experience was. Ill just stay out of this one

Well your telling someone not to get a FMIC, when that is probably one of the most important things in making a fast DSM.

I am currently running a 26x12x4" Yonaka FMIC which uses the same core as most of your ebay specials. I am already looking at purchasing a proper ETS or Garrett core, as I realize how much my current FMIC is holding me back. I'll even spend upto $1000 on a proper core as I know how important it is.

Also, removing your catalic converter makes a HUGE difference. It is a bottleneck. I picked up a significant amount of power when I did this years ago on my 14b powered car.

I would definitely say that if you are getting a front mount that get something that will be big enough with what you want in the future, but that's coming from someone who isn't a student.

If I was still a student, I would wait to get a FMIC until you have a turbo that will be something you want to stick with. The J-Pipes are not pocket change and will need to be replaced if you ever switch. If you go to a 14b then you can go for it, that way nothing is replaced when the 16g is done.

Good to know, I have been thinking about doing this, and because of the way that mine is plumbed in I can just remove the cat and piping, and plumb in straight pipe.

"How much back pressure does a cat create" you ask?
A LOT! Period. The straighter and the emptier the routing, the better. No, bigger is not always better, 3" is the butter zone for 95% of dsms out there. If you need bigger, it probably shouldn't be driven on roads and should be shot right out the side of the car.
I made a cat insert for my etest last year. The hooks that held it into place broke and it was fired 1/2 way down my exhaust just from the build up of back pressure. Tis was without hitting boost btw... Why did it stop 1/2 way? Because it hit a bend in the pipe.
This was the interior of a stock cat, not a high flow. I can't comment on those.
After you put a turbo back exhaust on (because there's no point putting a cat back as you're still bottlenecking through the down pipe) you'll notice a massive difference in spool, acceleration, and overall power of the car regardless of turbo.

The FIMC will of course increase performance on any turbo once installed just by its size and effect on IATs in comparison to the stock side mount. Perhaps it's not "worth while" as you're still running a t25, unless you plan on sticking with a Garrett style turbo, but still a mod that is necessary. And it looks sexy .

Don't forget, with a 225 you're in aftermarket AFPR territory. Or a retired 190 for that matter.

I don't have any logs with or without a cat as that is long gone but I see about a 300rpm difference in spool up on my FP Red with my cutout open, which simply shortens the exhaust from 10ish feet to about 1.5 feet. Back pressure makes a big difference on a turbo car.

I would also agree that when buying a FMIC, go big on the first time. I learned the hard way that my Punishment Racing core is just not cutting it anymore with the FP Red.

If I was to do it all over again, dsmlink would have been the #1 mod.

Hm, maybe I will give my cutout a try!

I did NOT at anytine tell him not to get a fmic... But He just has the core..and is a student on a budget, why spend a ton of time and too much money trying to get it to work with his t25 when his budget could be better spent on other mods to squeeze out as much power as possible on the t25. I totally agree he should get a proper fmic.... But only when it will make a good amount of difference... Like with a 14b or larger turbo.

His FIRST mod is to get a clutch that doesn't slip. Than get all his mechanical amd maintence items upto snuff. Then enjoy the car....

Agreed, if that is the case he should probably just get a full exhaust and enjoy the T25 as is. Of course get a clutch that holds this power too.

Before modding I'd probably do all the safety stuff first, like brakes, tires, ball joints, tie rods, bushings if needed, and an alignment. Make the car drive proper before modding

Couldn't agree with you more! I took too long to do these and my car did some funny stuff. I still have my tie rods left to do in the front, then some stuff to look at in the back.

x2

The boost controller will only get you into trouble.. not help lower boost. Infact get the fmic, and all the sapporting mods, and a boost controller.. run that t25 to 17psi or whatever and tune it..learn the art of water injection! It will actually raise the affeciancy of the tiny compressor! Then once its not enough.. and it wont be, Ricers will still eat you alive.. Then upgrade the turbo to a much larger turbo. biggest turbo you can afford. Unlike 10 years ago.. the biggest turbos you can fit on our cars spool really fast. And some can be had for the same price as evo16gs.

If yer gonna spend the cash on all the supporting mods.. injectors...fuel management.. exaust.. cooling..etc..etc..etc.. well your gonna spend alot of money on your car.. dont spend all that money and then waste it on a small td05 turbo.

If you dont want.. or cant.. spend alot of money on your car. Then grab a 14b, safc, and do all the free mods you can. It will get you close to 300hp.

How do you figure? He'd be able to set a given boost and not run whatever the ecu feels like on a given day with the stock solenoid.

I actually put hks cams on my green car with t25 and picked up about 15hp at 17psi.

Why wouldnt you just remove the solinoid? wether you tune it with Link or just a safc and some evo injectors.. the car shouldnt hit any boost cuts.

That or if you're on the cheap, just get better airflow to the current SMIC. Most people take the duct out at some point and that renders the SMIC very ineficient. Just buy another one or make one. That'll get you the most bang for your buck on the t25. Even a 1g SMIC into a 2g is an upgrade if you get the opening ends enlarged. If you still have the restrictive plastic piping, that also has to go.

Because you might want to run at a specific boost level, he'll need one at some point, might as well now.

Well ya.. No point in running a t25 with out more boost then stock. Even a 14b will be too slow withoit a mbc. But if he threw a 14b on the stock manifold with stock 14b jpipe and some creative diy plumbing. The car will run fine with out the boost controller.

The previous owner had a manual boost controller but couldnt get it working (claimed the boost was flying all over the place) so it is still attached in my engine bay just no vacuum lines hooked up

a forge one similar to the one shown in this link

http://www.powershoponline.com/wp-content/uploads/2012/08/Manual_Boost_Controllers_Forge_UNOS.jpg

he probably had it hooked up backwards. i accidently did that when I was messing around and my boost was all over the place, some days consistent, some days not.

Glad to know you think I give bad advice Reza.

Choke on your popcorn

Yup first thing he should do is relocate his alternator to the back of the motor
IMO an alternator relocation should only be done if you 100% have to, not on a stockish 2g DSM. Great advice buddy!

You go man!

WTF are you talking about dude?

I was addressing his post regarding him rebuilding his alternator. And me stating that a Saturn alternator relo'd to the back of the motor is what a lot of guys have done. If not relo'd then at least the "upgraded" Saturn alternator.

It's helpful information. NOT HIS FIRST MOD!!

Lay off the pipe broseph!

Manny no need to upgrade to a Saturn Alt just cause this guy gets boners over them. Do a little research on your own If this guy can't get an OEM alternator going on his car, he's doing something wrong.

If you got frustrated installing an OEM alt in the stock location, relocating to the back of the engine would probably be the last thing you want to do. I've seen people do this, what a pain in the butt it is once it gets fucked up again, lol.

Guys like me have been on a stock OEM alt for years, WITH NO ISSUES AT ALL No need to fix something that's not broke.

Just trying to help you out here Manny, not telling you useless sh!t to do, just cause I feel like posting something

+1 mines been running 22 years this November. Thanks Reza glad I am not the only one.

Lol... Well i think hes got enough advise.. Common weve only perfected the upgrade path for dsms like 15 yea ago. Everyone will have a differant opinion..example.. Lots of guys will tell you saturn alternators is a myth, yet almost half of everyone who mods thier dsms uses a saturn alt.

Its up to you to pick which path to go. Do some research cause if changing the alternator is a pain.. Then maybe swapping turbos right now is not such a good idea.

Well, you're officially an asshole in my books.

Sounds good buddy!

Same here, stock location stock alt and no heat shields. Have even had some power steering fluid dripped all over it and she is still good.

Two of my buddies have had the relocation bracket break on them, so I said to hell with that when I saw how much of a pain it was to deal with it.

This is good and all guys.. But first... Maybe some of you are lucky and some arnt.. But it IS a known fact that DSM alternators.. For whatever reason are failing on our cars.. Theres tones of posts on it. So ya.. It is a common issue. Just because someone got lucky and never had a problem with their stock dosent mean they know everything and evryone else is wrong.....

And need to be a dic about it.

Were all here to help each other not ridicule everyone cause they dont follow a certin path or bandwagon.

Second ... I currantly run a staurn alt and a dsm alt and the saturn alt performs much better. Plus its cheaper to replace.

Wasn't this thread about a intercooler? How did you guys even start talking about an alternator?

Cause somepeople know more then others

Mike and Reza: Dont make me come over there and make you two hug

And to all i've made a few threads in the short time i have been part of this forum and a majority of them have lead to a lot of new knowledge for me.

Majority if not all threads have been started because of the unending list of questions i have as i am new to the dsm world and all the info has been helpful

Everyones opinions have contributed towards my questions being answered and i hope it continues this way...that being said no need to dog someone elses opinion we're free to have one and if you dont agree then thats also your opinion

At the end of the day im all for maximizing the return for every dollar i invest in anything and that will be my route with my cars upcoming lengthy slow'n'steady build.

Mike i believe had suggested a build thread and i will most likely be beginning that (once an income stream has begun) for anyone who wants to follow.

Keep up the DSM love peeps!

I've seen a few of these relocation kits break too. I remember Kevin K having a bitch of a time with his, I think he had to take off his intake manifold or heater hoses just to pull out the alt once, lol. He ended up putting it back in the stock location, along with his PS pump. I'd say your chances of breaking down somewhere and getting stranded are higher with one of these relocation kits.

As for the Saturn alt, big woot. I've had 4 DSM's with OEM alternators running perfectly for years. I still haven't found the need to switch over to one. There is no possible way that 50% of DSM's are on saturn alternotrs, lol. Not sure where you are getting these stats from. I'm not lucky just cause I have my car running good with no problems and so aren't the other guys running OEM alternators. If your having issues, you would probably want to find a new place that rebuilds your alternators, you must be getting some pretty bad ones or you definately have some bad luck

No... I dissagree... Ive seen 2 alts in my possession go bad. Both oem replacements. And ive read alot of post on peoples stock oem alts and oem replacements go bad. My 1g has its original 92 alt. Never had to replace it. But its not as constant and lively as my saturn alt. Which is placed in the stock location. When it dies.. If it does.. I will replace it with a known reliable saturn alt for half the price. Cheaper for me cause i have a good source. You can say im wrong all you want.. And question my stats or info.. I dont care. But thats not what were here for. Were sappost to be buddies.... To hang out with and have fun.

It does happen tho... Alot. And it IS a common fail point on our cars. You cant deny that. It comes up quite often on every forum. So dont say it will never happen.

Yes I do hear of it, but then again 50% or more of DSM's out there are hack jobs. That's a fact! Must be that half

Either you have wiring issues in your car, or your rebuilder is not replacing the regulator in your alernator. That is the common issue with these rebuilds. Ever wonder why your OEM one that came with the car lasted the longest? I use OEM rebuilds with the regulators replaced in them. That is probably why I don't have issues.

I have only had 1 alternator fail and that was in the evo on the way to the S.0, and it was the original as far as I know.

First of all, let's get it straight....everyone is entitled to MY opinion......

I think the problem with the brackets breaking on the Jay Racing relocate kit are what caused him to start offering steel brackets instead of aluminum. As far as I know, no-one has had one of the steel brackets break.

As for it being a PITA, and whether there are or aren't benefits, I have no opinion, so I will also just grab popcorn.

Bang on. A lot of these rebuilders in this business are a joke.

Like i siad... Both alts that died on me were oem replacements. Straight from the dealer. And now ive hard and experianced 2 alternators die in my 2 trips to shoot out. They were the only casualties that i know of in 2 years of going to shoot out.( not counting Tims evo falling apart on the way home). I blieve Eric is on his 3rd oem alt. but shitty alternators or not... The saturn alts put out more amps.. And have a better ability to compansate for sudden changes in load.
But thats not really what this is about. Oem.. Saturn... What ever chose what you like there are milions of post about this topic. And i dont beleive im gonna change anyones mind after they been doing this for so long. BUT.. the whole point of my position in this thread was to defend Mike. As the OP had mentioned the alt replacement to be a pain in the ass..... And mike suggested a differant route ...A common route. It was never bad advise. Im sick of people giving their opinion and suggestions and then getting sh!t on by people who think their gods

MANNY if you want a easier way to replace your oem alt IF it ever needs to be replaced( and they do... All alternators do.. They wear out) Try my idea. I mounted my power steering pump to the back of my motor instead of the alt relocation. This cleaned up ky engie bay alot... Stopped the risk of dripping pwer steering fliud on my alternator and made swapping alternators a freaking breeze!

Thanks for the input Deep. As you guys run a shop you would know this first hand. This alternator myth is busted! As with most things with DSM's, people just like to follow the bandwagon

I would however say that if you don't have a good source for rebuilt OEM alternators, then you might as well go for a Saturn one and grind down your front case or block and do whatever it takes to run it!

My rebuilder can even make the OEM alternators pump out 120 AMPS as opposed to the 90. My buddies and I were running 120 AMP OEM alternators back in early 2000 with no issues at all. The only reason we ran these was because we would roll around with 2x12's and big amps in our DSM's pounding the streets of T.O.

OEM alternators 4eva

Jay, your dealer is probably getting them rebuilt from local shops who are not doing the rebuild proper. You seem to have quite the bad luck with these parts.

One of the two I've seen break was the steel one, I welded it for the guy and is still holding to this day to the best of my knowledge

I replaced my original alternator at 200k because of that myth. It was still running fine but I replaced just in case with the rebuild unit I got from Napa. I am also another DSMer who run OEM alternators without issues. My battery logs at 13.9 - 14.1 volts at idle and didn't drop when Terry S. stress-test it by turning all my electrical stuff on including cabin fan on high, high beams, stereo, and rear defroster.

Manny, it's nothing really. Just a bashing of one another opinions..the difference is I'll give you FREE advice. Whereas some people here like to charge $1,000 UP FRONT.

Like i said.. Its the arguement.. Not the content.... And as long as i keep trying to defend my buddies.. You will keep getting offended by me and defending your oem alts.


Ive had bad experiances with oem alts.. Other people hhave had bad experiances with oem alts.. Not everyone can have a good rebuilder around to make sure they live perfect lives like you. I chose the saturn alt cause ive had good luck with them for many years. They even have cooling fans on there pulleys. Plus i replaced my second oem alt with a saturn alt for less then half the price. Actually i get them for alot less since i have a really good sorce and am willing to help other dsms out by supplying them.


Mikes suggestion was just a part of being a club.. A close net club of dsm enthusiest.. Just haveing a good time and you have shown a new member some people here dont get along and think there better then everyone else. Bad advise would be telling him to run 25psi with atock injectors.... Or setting afrs to 14 at full boost all the time. There is nothing wrong with offering him the saturn relocation suggestion get over it.

I am not getting offended because you are running a Saturn alt. There are a handful of guys in this thread who are still running OEM as they stated. I guess you forgot to read their posts and your the only one having issues. Your taking this to the heart man.

Mike get it right, $1500 gets you through my door now, not $1000
CASH only, upfront! Don't like it, take a hike!

I don't tune sh!t ass DSM's for free, lol.

Ok you win reza... Im the only one who has problems with the oem alts.. No one else does.

Manny.. Hope you actually learned something from this thread to help biuld your car. We are all here to help and encourage you... For free...sometimes beer.

Well some of us.

This is not about winning and losing. I'll I said was you guys are giving bad advice, I didn't mean to come off in a wrong way. We all have our opinions I was just throwing in mines. I didn't mean to touch any feelings.

You guys can think I'm a dic or asshole, call me names, but thats fine. Just trying to have a constructive argument with facts. I'll try not to do that with you two next time.

I still love you all .
Everyone who knows me, knows I don't charge $1500 or $1000 for tuning. You gotta be pretty stupid if your gonna pay me that , and if you really are that stupid I'll be happy to take your money.

See I don't take things to heart, lets grab a beer if we ever meet, it'll be on me I wanna see that relocated Saturn Alt

Might as well share my theory about alternators: the downpipe flex section is often the problem. My original alt was fine for 200k and then I went through three before I figured out I had a cracked flex section - you couldn't even see the crack underneath that braided stainless meshy.

I don't have experience with a FMIC on a T25 but I did have a 14b and FMIC for a while and that was a HUGE difference over the stock pea shooter.

Screw alternators, just go with a 16v battery

My rebuilt OEM alternator lasted all summer. Some long drives, lots of sitting in traffic.

Its a US alt, so not the best voltage, but with a heat blanket for the turbo and manifold plus a wrapped down pipe and O2 housing and the thing hasn't died yet. Even had coolant spill on it and at one point a screw fell on it and it sparked a lot.

Was just about to pick up a alternator relocation kit too. Good thing this was discussed though!

LOL you guys are hilarious.

I enjoy the constructive arguments because I get to see different point of views and see what works for others, then decide which option is the easiest and do that

I never personally fried a single OEM alternator on any of my 3 previous DSMs. And none of them ever had the downpipe shields. One had 200k the other had 260+k when pulled and sold, in perfect working order.

Sometimes it's not just the heat. How many DSMs have leaking P/S pumps or valve cover gaskets slowly leaking and making their way into the alternator?

On my Elantra, the downpipe is heat wrapped but sits 1" from the back of the alternator. I fried the original OEM alternator at 317k. But not because of the heat. It was caked in oil from my valve cover gasket. Changed the gasket, then I put an OE-rebuilt alternator from Crappy, brand new, killed it in 1 minute of running. Returned it, went to the junkyard and pulled another factory OEM with who knows how many KMS and I get perfect voltage all day long.

And enough about the alternators.

Get that damn FMIC in there. If you plan to mod your car, you're gonna need to do it sooner or later. May as well sooner.

FWIW, the only thing that has ever killed an OEM alternator in the Talon was a long-lasting power steering leak that just gunked up the alternator to sh!t. But even then it didn't just die, it was a slow progression.

reza your a dic and a asshole... end rant

i have a feeling i saw reza driving in brampton today. By airport rd and countryside?

Manny, something like that goes into the war stories & sighting

Sorry about that

Haha, no worries, just figured I would let you know where things generally go

Wasn't me. Must've be a Reza wannabe if it had a carbon fibre hood and black RPF1 rims

lol, wow, long thread and I'm bringing it back after a couple of months.

Key thing to take away from all this Manny is to TAKE YOUR TIME, do NOT rush, and do things incrementally.

DO NOT do it the way I did, and never panic and do something stupid like buy another DSM to replace your already working DSM, because the seller "seemed like a nice guy".

Haha.

You'll get a kick out of a bigger fuel pump, 14B, and a FMIC. Oh and a 1G BOV to keep all that boost in without leaking.

Do ALL maintenance first. I mean everything, before even attempting to add any power makers.

That's it.

Soooooo, where are you at with the car now?

Edit: forgot to add a manual boost controller, which can be had for pennies.

So far:

-I have gotten the alternator rebuilt as it gave out on me and had to get it rebuilt again last month but 1 year warranty on the work so was just a pain to remove and reinstall again

-been doing oil changes every 2000 miles switched to a 5w for the winter as i was hearing lifter tick

-undercoated and installed winter tires

I do custom homes and reno's and as of now I haven't had any projects locked in so finances are tight not allowing me to do any leisure upgrades though I am currently trying to lock in a job

When I've got some extra cash my immediate plan is to hopefully buy Terry's tranny (i am nervous about my current tranny as i am noticing a slipping clutch and notchy shifting will think about clutch fluid flush soon)

and also i desperately need to give my suspension some attention as the previous owner only put tein s tech lowering springs and when i am punching my 2G the front end flies up, going to try and get some coilovers

my air filter for the cold air needs to be replaced aswell and when i do get that i plan to remove the intake pipe and SMIC and give them a good cleaning to get any oil buildup out

also hoping to get my hands on a crankcase breather with a catch can

also i do have a forge manual boost controller just havent gotten around to running the vac lines (not sure if i need it with my current almost oem standing)

Holy sh!t Michael your learning. I cant wait to see what is actually wrong with your car.... dont worry it will be our secret.

If everyone who's owned a DSM for any length of time had to "fess up" about something they did or didn't do that they weren't too proud of, it would be one heck of a big fess party.

My list is short. After 22 years of ownership.

Like wise (after 5 years) Shes no daily driver so I have a ton of time to research first before I pull the trigger, I simply don't have enough time for 'trial and error'

Manny, If you feel like driving to Gtown I can help with the small stuff.

Transmission swap... That's all I have to say.

In the works Johnny and I'll remember that Terry just gotta find the time...holiday shopping doesnt help

Am i better off getting an air filter from part source or rtm, i mean is it that big of a difference in price?

Anything i should keep in mind when looking at filters? (I really like the look of the HKS mushroom filter but does another perform better?)

The part about buying from RTM vs parts source. Is that you are supporting a couple of really good guys instead of a fat corparation. Ziggy and Paul do their best to support these boards and add valuable info here. Other then the shipping cost they are very well priced. I would used them alot more for parts on all my side work, unfotunately I get most of my parts at cost plus 10%

Go watch a few episodes of MCM they do testing on air filters, pretty much they are all the same, just choose one you like.

+1

Keep the money in the DSM community! They'll keep the supply of fresh parts for our cars! It's the most logical thing to do in my mind!

I had/have one on one of my cars, and can say it doesn't filter much, you're better off with a cone filter from K&N or something, skip the mushroom if it's going to be a DD.

That's what I'm fessing up to. lol I completely overlooked the difference in final drives when I did my AWD swap.

You're doing a transmission swap, Manny?

I thought you just liked doing rear end swaps, so you did it, so you could do it again.

@Johnny I am probably going to be picking up Terry's current fwd tranny...awd swap isn't going to happen anytime soon