Oil Discussion
#323513
February 07, 2010 10:08 pm UTC
February 07, 2010 10:08 pm UTC
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Joined: Oct 2005
Posts: 10,749 Belleville, Ontario
Ryan Laliberte
OP
No-Lift-To-Shift.... Stock. :)
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OP
No-Lift-To-Shift.... Stock. :)
Senior Member, with Far TOO Much Time on Their Hands
Joined: Oct 2005
Posts: 10,749
Belleville, Ontario
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Brandon and I are having a debate, lets open it up to the board.
Brandon runs 20W50 in his Talon. I say run 10W30.
His argument: Cooling properties My argument: Too thick for the tight tolerances and passages, as well as too high oil pressure for the car.
Discuss.
AWDAuto 1996 TSi AWD Automagic12.24 @ 113 - Small 16G FP Green HTA - 11.42/123 Team Pump Gas and Meth RTMRacing - Your Canadian source for DSM Parts "Every moment you live is pregnant with the next moment of your life" --Jim CarreyLast Login: September 28, 2021
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Re: Oil Discussion
[Re: Ryan Laliberte]
#323514
February 07, 2010 10:09 pm UTC
February 07, 2010 10:09 pm UTC
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Joined: Aug 2007
Posts: 4,796 Oshawa, Ontario, Canada
Brandon Clement
Senior Member, with Far TOO Much Time on Their Hands
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Senior Member, with Far TOO Much Time on Their Hands
Joined: Aug 2007
Posts: 4,796
Oshawa, Ontario, Canada
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I also ran 20w50 in my 94 for 2 years, no issues, I switched to 5w30 in the winter time for less wear on the engine when cold starting.
No more Jetta! Tattoo Artist at Lost Anchor
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Re: Oil Discussion
[Re: jerry white]
#323523
February 07, 2010 10:44 pm UTC
February 07, 2010 10:44 pm UTC
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Joined: Oct 2005
Posts: 10,749 Belleville, Ontario
Ryan Laliberte
OP
No-Lift-To-Shift.... Stock. :)
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OP
No-Lift-To-Shift.... Stock. :)
Senior Member, with Far TOO Much Time on Their Hands
Joined: Oct 2005
Posts: 10,749
Belleville, Ontario
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What I would like to know is why? What performance gains or longevity would you gain from running this thick an oil? I'm all up for switching, if I can learn why. Sure there is research, but it's more fun this way.
AWDAuto 1996 TSi AWD Automagic12.24 @ 113 - Small 16G FP Green HTA - 11.42/123 Team Pump Gas and Meth RTMRacing - Your Canadian source for DSM Parts "Every moment you live is pregnant with the next moment of your life" --Jim CarreyLast Login: September 28, 2021
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Re: Oil Discussion
[Re: jerry white]
#323525
February 07, 2010 10:44 pm UTC
February 07, 2010 10:44 pm UTC
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Joined: Aug 2007
Posts: 4,796 Oshawa, Ontario, Canada
Brandon Clement
Senior Member, with Far TOO Much Time on Their Hands
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Senior Member, with Far TOO Much Time on Their Hands
Joined: Aug 2007
Posts: 4,796
Oshawa, Ontario, Canada
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I'm reppin' for the 20w50!
Better cooling and lubricating properties in high heat applications, like our disgusting humid summers here in Canada.
No more Jetta! Tattoo Artist at Lost Anchor
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Re: Oil Discussion
[Re: Mark Bondy]
#323531
February 07, 2010 11:49 pm UTC
February 07, 2010 11:49 pm UTC
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Joined: Oct 2005
Posts: 10,749 Belleville, Ontario
Ryan Laliberte
OP
No-Lift-To-Shift.... Stock. :)
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OP
No-Lift-To-Shift.... Stock. :)
Senior Member, with Far TOO Much Time on Their Hands
Joined: Oct 2005
Posts: 10,749
Belleville, Ontario
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Added a poll to make thing easier.
5W30
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23%, 6 Votes
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10W30
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62%, 16 Votes
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5W40
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4%, 1 Votes
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20W50
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12%, 3 Votes
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AWDAuto 1996 TSi AWD Automagic12.24 @ 113 - Small 16G FP Green HTA - 11.42/123 Team Pump Gas and Meth RTMRacing - Your Canadian source for DSM Parts "Every moment you live is pregnant with the next moment of your life" --Jim CarreyLast Login: September 28, 2021
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Re: Oil Discussion
[Re: Ryan Laliberte]
#323536
February 08, 2010 01:09 am UTC
February 08, 2010 01:09 am UTC
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Joined: Aug 2007
Posts: 4,796 Oshawa, Ontario, Canada
Brandon Clement
Senior Member, with Far TOO Much Time on Their Hands
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Senior Member, with Far TOO Much Time on Their Hands
Joined: Aug 2007
Posts: 4,796
Oshawa, Ontario, Canada
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Adding a poll will not really make it easier, because you were trying to tell me that 20w50 will blow my seals in my motor. And the discussion is more so is 20w50 bad for your motor, or is it good for your motor, not what oil do you use.
A lot of people just look in the owners manual, see 10w30, and are like ok, good enough. Where I think that 10w30 definitely makes the cut in the summer and winter, but I think that 5w30 is way too thin for this turbo motor in the summer, I think 10w30 is just making the cut but will still thin out pretty good.
I think oils like 5w40, 20w50, or 15w40 will provide better lubrication to the motor and help to disperse heat better, when it's hotter outside, anything over 15 degrees and sunny.
Even with 20w50, I never had an issue with lifter tick, or anything like that. Granted, I switch it out around October to a 5w30.
No more Jetta! Tattoo Artist at Lost Anchor
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Re: Oil Discussion
[Re: Brandon Clement]
#323537
February 08, 2010 01:13 am UTC
February 08, 2010 01:13 am UTC
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Joined: Oct 2005
Posts: 10,749 Belleville, Ontario
Ryan Laliberte
OP
No-Lift-To-Shift.... Stock. :)
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OP
No-Lift-To-Shift.... Stock. :)
Senior Member, with Far TOO Much Time on Their Hands
Joined: Oct 2005
Posts: 10,749
Belleville, Ontario
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I'm not trying to tell you it will blow your seals in the motor, I'm telling you the high oil pressure caused by a decrease in viscosity will not help your seals in your motor, as the increased pressure puts strain on them. Why do you think guys port their oil relief valves when they do a B/S elimination? Too high of oil pressure IS NOT good for a motor. As for the cooling aspect, yes I would agree that a thicker oil does help with cooling, and yes it will lubricate better than say a 5W30 or 10W30. I am looking at this from a performance aspect, would 20W50 be a better oil to use than say 10W30, and why? Like I said before, I want to learn.
AWDAuto 1996 TSi AWD Automagic12.24 @ 113 - Small 16G FP Green HTA - 11.42/123 Team Pump Gas and Meth RTMRacing - Your Canadian source for DSM Parts "Every moment you live is pregnant with the next moment of your life" --Jim CarreyLast Login: September 28, 2021
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Re: Oil Discussion
[Re: Ryan Laliberte]
#323539
February 08, 2010 01:19 am UTC
February 08, 2010 01:19 am UTC
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Joined: Aug 2007
Posts: 4,796 Oshawa, Ontario, Canada
Brandon Clement
Senior Member, with Far TOO Much Time on Their Hands
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Senior Member, with Far TOO Much Time on Their Hands
Joined: Aug 2007
Posts: 4,796
Oshawa, Ontario, Canada
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I will have to install a nice oil pressure gauge from auto meter soon again and we will find out exactly what kind of oil pressure it runs the car at. I don't remember what it was at on my 94. Also, maybe they port their oil relief valves so they can run 20w50 at a lower oil pressure
No more Jetta! Tattoo Artist at Lost Anchor
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Re: Oil Discussion
[Re: Rob Strelecki]
#323566
February 08, 2010 01:11 pm UTC
February 08, 2010 01:11 pm UTC
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Joined: Oct 2005
Posts: 10,749 Belleville, Ontario
Ryan Laliberte
OP
No-Lift-To-Shift.... Stock. :)
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OP
No-Lift-To-Shift.... Stock. :)
Senior Member, with Far TOO Much Time on Their Hands
Joined: Oct 2005
Posts: 10,749
Belleville, Ontario
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I know when I fire up my car in late fall this year running 10W30, my oil pressure skyrocketted quite high, upwards of 100+psi on a cold startup. I could only imagine what it would be with 20W50!
AWDAuto 1996 TSi AWD Automagic12.24 @ 113 - Small 16G FP Green HTA - 11.42/123 Team Pump Gas and Meth RTMRacing - Your Canadian source for DSM Parts "Every moment you live is pregnant with the next moment of your life" --Jim CarreyLast Login: September 28, 2021
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Re: Oil Discussion
[Re: Robert Clare]
#323570
February 08, 2010 02:55 pm UTC
February 08, 2010 02:55 pm UTC
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Joined: Oct 2002
Posts: 646 Kitchener
Paul Kruger
Serious Member
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Serious Member
Joined: Oct 2002
Posts: 646
Kitchener
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IMO, asking what you run, without any sort of details on when your running it, or where, how you plan to drive, isn't super helpful. Secondly, one man's notchy is another mans 'tight'. So your going to get plenty of un-quantifiable opinions on this topic. Fun winter conversation anyhow I wouldn't feel bad about running 20w50 in my race motor, that's been clearanced, that's warmed up to (oil!) temp before it's expected to take load, on a 20c day, then expected to take an absolute pounding for 10 seconds, and head back to the paddock with a cool-down. Would I put it in my daily driver that starts in -20, and probably hasn't hit target oil temp by the time it's parked? No oil pressure/temp gauge? Not a chance. It'll get 5w30. Horses for courses. Oil's a tool sized to fit a job, not an exact science. FWIW Ryan, the time it takes to get 20w up to the head from a cold start would worry me. And depending on where your sourcing your oil for the turbo, it might be running without oil for a few seconds every time it starts. I'd side with you and say for a street car, in the summer, 10w30 makes a fairly well rounded oil in all but the most demanding heat/pressure. Paul
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Re: Oil Discussion
[Re: Rob Strelecki]
#323571
February 08, 2010 03:18 pm UTC
February 08, 2010 03:18 pm UTC
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Joined: Aug 2007
Posts: 4,796 Oshawa, Ontario, Canada
Brandon Clement
Senior Member, with Far TOO Much Time on Their Hands
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Senior Member, with Far TOO Much Time on Their Hands
Joined: Aug 2007
Posts: 4,796
Oshawa, Ontario, Canada
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10w30 seems too thick on a cold spring or fall day, I wouldn't ever put 20w50 in. I switch to 5w30 when I change the oil at the end of summer.
I would say run the thinner oil and change it more religiously! The issue is not the oil breaking down quicker, the issue that on an extremely hot day, 10w30 will thin out too much and I believe, cause additional wear and tear on your engine while it's being run hard. Of course there are different applications for different oil. I will be trying a 5w40 or a 5w50 full synthetic this summer to see how it is on the oil pressure gauge and how my engine seems to like it. 5w50 or 5w40 will provide me with an oil that will flow nicely on start up, but after heated will be nice and thick still for the cooling properties. And on a cold start, if the oil pressure is 10 - 20 psi higher than it is with 5w30, you wouldn't have to worry about it reaching your head or your turbo in time!
No more Jetta! Tattoo Artist at Lost Anchor
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Re: Oil Discussion
[Re: Brandon Clement]
#323572
February 08, 2010 03:25 pm UTC
February 08, 2010 03:25 pm UTC
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Joined: Aug 2007
Posts: 4,796 Oshawa, Ontario, Canada
Brandon Clement
Senior Member, with Far TOO Much Time on Their Hands
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Senior Member, with Far TOO Much Time on Their Hands
Joined: Aug 2007
Posts: 4,796
Oshawa, Ontario, Canada
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And also, like mentioned before, I switch my oils depending on the time of the year, 5w30 in the winter, 20w50 in the summer. Or well, 5w40 or 5w50 this summer
No more Jetta! Tattoo Artist at Lost Anchor
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Re: Oil Discussion
[Re: Robert Clare]
#323644
February 09, 2010 03:29 am UTC
February 09, 2010 03:29 am UTC
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Joined: Oct 2005
Posts: 10,749 Belleville, Ontario
Ryan Laliberte
OP
No-Lift-To-Shift.... Stock. :)
|
OP
No-Lift-To-Shift.... Stock. :)
Senior Member, with Far TOO Much Time on Their Hands
Joined: Oct 2005
Posts: 10,749
Belleville, Ontario
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Hmmm, definitely some food for thought.
So, since the car is a summer DD, a 20W50 could, theoretically, help "quiet" the motor, reduce phantom knock, and keep pressure higher at idle.
Perhaps a 10W30 in the spring, 20W50 in the summer, then back to a 10W30 in the fall.
Oil viscosity would change with me depending on the season.
AWDAuto 1996 TSi AWD Automagic12.24 @ 113 - Small 16G FP Green HTA - 11.42/123 Team Pump Gas and Meth RTMRacing - Your Canadian source for DSM Parts "Every moment you live is pregnant with the next moment of your life" --Jim CarreyLast Login: September 28, 2021
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Re: Oil Discussion
[Re: Ryan Laliberte]
#323646
February 09, 2010 03:45 am UTC
February 09, 2010 03:45 am UTC
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Joined: Aug 2007
Posts: 4,796 Oshawa, Ontario, Canada
Brandon Clement
Senior Member, with Far TOO Much Time on Their Hands
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Senior Member, with Far TOO Much Time on Their Hands
Joined: Aug 2007
Posts: 4,796
Oshawa, Ontario, Canada
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Can always try it out, you will know almost instantly if the motor doesn't agree with the oil. And if not, then drain it out and put in a thinner weight of oil.
No more Jetta! Tattoo Artist at Lost Anchor
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Re: Oil Discussion
[Re: Reza Mirza]
#323786
February 10, 2010 03:46 pm UTC
February 10, 2010 03:46 pm UTC
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Joined: Aug 2007
Posts: 4,796 Oshawa, Ontario, Canada
Brandon Clement
Senior Member, with Far TOO Much Time on Their Hands
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Senior Member, with Far TOO Much Time on Their Hands
Joined: Aug 2007
Posts: 4,796
Oshawa, Ontario, Canada
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I have never ever ported the relief valve at all on any DSM's I have owned, and have run all of them without b shafts for the last 10 years with no issues at all with excessive oil pressure causing problems That's because you are a freak of the DSM World!!
No more Jetta! Tattoo Artist at Lost Anchor
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Re: Oil Discussion
[Re: Daniel Reis]
#323823
February 10, 2010 07:19 pm UTC
February 10, 2010 07:19 pm UTC
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Joined: Aug 2007
Posts: 4,796 Oshawa, Ontario, Canada
Brandon Clement
Senior Member, with Far TOO Much Time on Their Hands
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Senior Member, with Far TOO Much Time on Their Hands
Joined: Aug 2007
Posts: 4,796
Oshawa, Ontario, Canada
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No more Jetta! Tattoo Artist at Lost Anchor
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Re: Oil Discussion
[Re: Robert Clare]
#323860
February 10, 2010 10:40 pm UTC
February 10, 2010 10:40 pm UTC
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Joined: Aug 2007
Posts: 4,796 Oshawa, Ontario, Canada
Brandon Clement
Senior Member, with Far TOO Much Time on Their Hands
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Senior Member, with Far TOO Much Time on Their Hands
Joined: Aug 2007
Posts: 4,796
Oshawa, Ontario, Canada
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oh snap, I'm definitely going to stock up
No more Jetta! Tattoo Artist at Lost Anchor
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