Turbo slow to spool
#110667
May 15, 2004 01:48 am UTC
May 15, 2004 01:48 am UTC
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Joined: Jul 2002
Posts: 2,787 Pickering, ON
Nick Boers
OP
Insane Member
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OP
Insane Member
Joined: Jul 2002
Posts: 2,787
Pickering, ON
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After destroying an SRT-4 on the highway a few days back, and blowing an IC pipe off at the end of the pull, AND putting hte pipe back on the next day, i've noticed that the turbo doesn't hit full boost until 5200rpm now. Usually hit full at about 3800.
Important info: 10:1, Haltech, 1050cc, 57 trim T04E, Tial 38mm.
Things i have done/checked: Turbine wheel and housing OK Compressor OK IC pipe leak test OK Cylinder leakdown OK Tial Valve and seat OK Boost controller operation OK Exhaust leaks OK Timing is OK
I pulled the exhaust, and slid a flashlight up from the muffler, and i could see through the cat as usual. It's not a light brown like the used cat i have on the shelf, it's pretty black.
I'm going to go gut the cat, unless someone has any better ideas.
Anyone?
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Re: Turbo slow to spool
#110669
May 15, 2004 06:34 pm UTC
May 15, 2004 06:34 pm UTC
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Joined: Apr 2003
Posts: 903 Etobocoke
Tony Lowell
Member
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Member
Joined: Apr 2003
Posts: 903
Etobocoke
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Maybe one of the vacuum lines is partially clogged with a bit of dirt? It won't show a leak but it would obstruct the air flow.
Similar to when your vacuum cleaner is partially clogged you don't get full vacuum until the motor 'revs' at a higher RPM.
Maybe pull them off one by one and blow through them. It's free.
Just an idea.
Cheers Tony
The old guy 91TSi FWD vintage
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Re: Turbo slow to spool
#110670
May 15, 2004 07:59 pm UTC
May 15, 2004 07:59 pm UTC
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Joined: Mar 2003
Posts: 5,126 Toronto
Rob Cauduro
Senior Member, with Far TOO Much Time on Their Hands
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Senior Member, with Far TOO Much Time on Their Hands
Joined: Mar 2003
Posts: 5,126
Toronto
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I have been haunted by this problem since I have owned this Talon.
At fist with the 14b way back, it took way long to spool. Found out I had a bunch of vaccume leaks, and a massive crack in the waste gate opening.
Fixed the leaks and baught a big 16g (almost new) I ran that all last summer and still felt my boost wasnt comming on strong enough. I didnt think much of it and thought it was caused by a big crack in the exhaust manifold.
This year I got a near mint 2G mani, green turbo and all new piping and the thing still wont boost fast. I dont know if I am just used to my 90 (totally stock) and how it max boosts at the touch of the throttle.
When crusing in third gear at approx 3000 rpm, if I mash the throttle, I wont hit full boost till almost 5000. If I am in second gear crusing slowly at around 3000 rpm, when I mash the throttle, it picks up nicely but I still dont see 20 psi till around 42-4500. I thought greens were supposed to spool hella fast like a 14b/16g etc...
Now, you mention timing Nick. When setting my base timing, my idle at 750 rpms was so lumpy, I couldnt get a proper alignment on the timing cover to the pully. It bounced all around because of the lumpy idle. I set it as close as I could to 8* BTDC
I have no intake leaks, timing seems close enough, turbo is near new, no cat to worrie about etc... I am stumped as well.
The only time I can get boost on demand is when I am on the highway already doing high speeds and the engine is reving 3000 + rpm's.
Hope you find something out and let me know how you fixed it.
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Re: Turbo slow to spool
#110671
May 15, 2004 08:21 pm UTC
May 15, 2004 08:21 pm UTC
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Joined: Jul 2002
Posts: 2,787 Pickering, ON
Nick Boers
OP
Insane Member
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OP
Insane Member
Joined: Jul 2002
Posts: 2,787
Pickering, ON
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Tony, the vacuum lines on my car are all 1/4" ID. They're for the BOV, MAP sensor, and hte boost controller. BOV works fine, MAP reads fine, and there's tons of flow in he boost controller lines.
Rob, with a stock bottom end, a green will spool that slow. You just don't get boost at 3k on a larger turbo like that.
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Re: Turbo slow to spool
#110675
May 15, 2004 11:22 pm UTC
May 15, 2004 11:22 pm UTC
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Joined: Jul 2002
Posts: 2,787 Pickering, ON
Nick Boers
OP
Insane Member
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OP
Insane Member
Joined: Jul 2002
Posts: 2,787
Pickering, ON
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Rob, it's a TD05-7cm exhaust housing, but it's a TD06H turbine, and a T04E 50 trim compressor. It's a BIG turbine! MUCH bigger than a 1G turbine.
Ken Barkhouse had one in his Eclipse with a 9:1 motor, and it didn't hit full boost till 4k or so. It was useless at 3k on the highway, he needed to downshift.
I pressure tested the exhaust, found a few minor leaks in the manifold, but nothing that would cause this. The Tial outlet gasket is pooched, and leaking quite a bit, but since it's downstream of hte turbo/gate, it's not going to hurt spoolup.
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Re: Turbo slow to spool
#110676
May 15, 2004 11:59 pm UTC
May 15, 2004 11:59 pm UTC
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Joined: Nov 2002
Posts: 569 Almost North Oshawa
Andrew Wilson
Gene Pool Police
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Gene Pool Police
Joined: Nov 2002
Posts: 569
Almost North Oshawa
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hey Nick what was the compression test reading (psi?)
if you're caught doing 140kmh in a 100 zone = a few points 150kmh in a 100 zone, you'll be arrested. 350kmh in a 100 zone, you'll be shot. On the side of the road. Like a rabid dog...
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Re: Turbo slow to spool
#110677
May 16, 2004 12:01 am UTC
May 16, 2004 12:01 am UTC
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Joined: Nov 2002
Posts: 569 Almost North Oshawa
Andrew Wilson
Gene Pool Police
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Gene Pool Police
Joined: Nov 2002
Posts: 569
Almost North Oshawa
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also how much ign timing is there between 3500 and 5k ?
if you're caught doing 140kmh in a 100 zone = a few points 150kmh in a 100 zone, you'll be arrested. 350kmh in a 100 zone, you'll be shot. On the side of the road. Like a rabid dog...
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Re: Turbo slow to spool
#110678
May 16, 2004 02:05 am UTC
May 16, 2004 02:05 am UTC
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Joined: Jul 2002
Posts: 2,787 Pickering, ON
Nick Boers
OP
Insane Member
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OP
Insane Member
Joined: Jul 2002
Posts: 2,787
Pickering, ON
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I don't have a compression tester, i just apply 100psi to each cylinder at TDC and check for leaks, and the amount of air coming out the PCV. No valve leaks, no gasket leaks, and just a tiny bit of air from the PCV, same as a few months ago.
12-15degrees. At 3k and 3k5 it drops sharply at atmospheric pressure to aid in spoolup. By the time it got to 4k it was always fully spooled, so i didn't put the same sharp cutoff in the maps at 4k and above. I was about to take the laptop to the car and try it out.
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Re: Turbo slow to spool
#110681
May 16, 2004 11:06 am UTC
May 16, 2004 11:06 am UTC
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Joined: Apr 2003
Posts: 903 Etobocoke
Tony Lowell
Member
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Member
Joined: Apr 2003
Posts: 903
Etobocoke
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Maybe a vacuum line was partially clogged with dirt Seriously, make a note of eveything you did while it is still fresh in your mind just in case the problem returns. The notes will give you a good base point for diagnosis. I'm glad you've got the 'magic touch' and it's working. Cheers Tony
The old guy 91TSi FWD vintage
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