It's all the same...

Cars are gay....

You're not living till you're on one wheel.

-AWD 1G DSM: $5000
-Mods: 16G, 3 inch exhaust, ACT 2600, MBC: $2500.
vs.
-2WD 1G DSM: $2000
-Mods: MBC, Cat Back exhaust: $250.
-Look on AWD's face as you rip them a new bunghole from behind on the highway or a rolling start: PRICELESS!

Or try this one.

-AWD 1G DSM: $5000
-Mods: 16G, 3 inch exhaust, ACT 2600, MBC: $2500.
vs.
-2WD DSM: $2000
-Mods: 20G, 3 inch exhaust, ACT 2100, MBC, 550cc Injectors, Standalone Engine management, Phantom Grip LSD, Etc :$7000
-Look on 2WD's face as the AWD rips them a new bunghole from in front in the 1/8 mile as he can't out any power down: Priceless.

HAHAAHAHAHAHAH STFU you dumb newbie!

DO YOU PEOPLE NOT READ INTO JOKES??? Hello Mcfly?

By the way My turbo Sonata , the car you dont know nothing about will eat you for breakfast lunch and dinner and time for snack in between before your Crankwalking AWD is nothing but a spec of dust.

AHAHAHAHAH

LOL@MIKE SMITH!!!

Thomas, please bet this guy some money... Or better yet, race for pinks!

My opinion in this matter is AWD. I can't stand how properly modded FWDs break loose so easily in most gears... And plus, if you're in an AWD and you already got them on the 60ft, you can slow down and not have to worry about anything else... They're watching your brake lights by then. Of course, they'll say "Race me from a roll" at the next lights and you can simply smile and say "No thanks", thusly keeping your honor and title!

G.

HAhaha nah , he is a rookie and doesnt know the Hyundai, just like most, wouldnt be fair. Let him talk smack i dont care really

THIS WILL GO ON FOREVER...IT WILL NEVER END.

After driving my AWD talon for a good 8 mths, I don't miss it. Sure it's nice to give F-bodies a newfound respect for a stock talon but I hated how it will bog on a street start, how it's just slow on the highway. How it will understeer when pushed into a corner.

I will take a RWD car anyday (that is not snowing). In actuallity, I enjoy driving my N/T FWD Galant a lot more... as odd as it may sound. All it needs is a little dose of power.

AWD vs. FWD vs RWD..bah!

The acceleration king only has 2 wheels. Any 600+ cc sports bike will make all but the most highly tuned 4 wheeler eat dust..highway or strip. Hell, even my old 250cc TZ 2 stroker will give u guys a hefty dose of 2T oil.

i rest my case.

ps. Ronnie... most ppl here have never been on a bike...let alone a fast one....so don't blame them.

I hear the NHRA just moved their christmas trees 120 feet up the track to accomodate rolling starts... FWDs REJOICE!

Down boy. Didn't mean to ruffle feathers. I'm not talking smack, just giving my opinion like every one else on this board. I prefer AWD.

Racing for pinks?? I think the auditions for F&F 2 are done.

All the power to the turbo Sonata, the Ultimate Sleeper.

Newbie. Cute. So how many posts till you know what your talking about round here, 500, 1000, 2000, ??

Nice. It was on the tip of my tongue.

Good point. Just because you don't have a large post count (we all know post counts equal wisdom and penis size, right? :rolleyes: )doesn't mean you don't know what you are talking about.

I know high posters who don't know what they are talking about. I don't know what I'm talking about 50% of the time. Well, I'm lying, I NEVER know what I'm talking about!

Why does this competition still continue? I mean this will never be mainstream and certainly not before H fuel cell.

I can see it all now...yeah I'll be into work in 3 hours after I srcape the ice off my entire car to expose the cells...oh wait its overcast.

120km/h in that green sliver? Hope it has a 6-point cage.

Fuel for the fire: AWDs handle better, especially with some suspension mods to make them more neutral or even oversteer under power.

Oh, and Amin, please don't post huge pictures in threads without linking to them. Give people a choice!

Why can't we just get along! hehehe In case you guys didn't notice, there should have been a sarcastic tone to my "race for pinks" comment, which was followed by the , making it a joke. Some people need to relaxxxxxxxx!

I still say AWD, unless I could get my hands on the Charger again.

learn how to drive and you won't have these problems. Especially bogging on a start, any decent driver will never have his AWd talon bogg.

Ok the logic is AWD are heavier therefore they are slower im am #1 so use only one finger next time like everyone else does when they salute me haha

Try not to be the arrogant bitch you are Vince

Not everyone likes to slip at 2500+ rpm everytime when you dont want to race. MY AWD suck at street starts. And with so much driveline drag and actually making less power than an NT engine off boost, I very often find myself having to drive around town one gear lower than I like to. Sure it's fun to race, but 99.9% of my driving is not racing.

My Galant(s) pot around town happily at 1700rpm in 5th goign 60..accerelates from that without bogging or feels "luged on". I would like to see an AWD Talon do that without protesting.

Try not to be the arrogant bitch you are Vince

Not everyone likes to slip at 2500+ rpm everytime when you dont want to race. MY AWD suck at street starts. And with so much driveline drag and actually making less power than an NT engine off boost, I very often find myself having to drive around town one gear lower than I like to. Sure it's fun to race, but 99.9% of my driving is not racing.

My Galant(s) pot around town happily at 1700rpm in 5th goign 60..accerelates from that without bogging or feels "luged on". I would like to see an AWD Talon do that without protesting.

I pull away from a light consistently at 1200rpm in my awd. It's got a ceramic clutch, and 264 cams. It's got no low end torque compared to a stock turbo talon, and the clutch is very grabby.

I don't understand how you're having such a problem

I can cruise in 5th at about 70. There's just not enough torque at 1800 rpm with those cams to pull it in 5th.

Sorry guy I am not being arrogant, I am just saying you don't know how to drive if you are bogging your stock AWD at stop lights.

As Nick said it's very easy not to bogg your AWD Talon. I have an ACT 2600 and a lighetned flywheel and I have no problem starting from a stop at 1000rpm whout bogging. I don't know what your problem is but it's not the car.

Ok lets try this again ...

It is there because US puts some money into it. This will NEVER be main stream but it has its own reasons. SOlar Car are more polluting.

The grean one and the silver red one both reach high up there, 120ish. They have 5 point harness I think.
Ours has it too, rules. The safety is well thought about

haha.. Vince...

me not know how to drive? Lets just say I can drive a lot better than you can even imagine. And not just on a straight road. I have an advanced drivers licence that allows me to run on various local GP tracks back home (Pasir Gudang, Sepang), where me and my buddy drive a Group N Silvia 1.8 Turbo, a Group A 1600 Lancer, and my TZ-250 bike for club races.

I'm just not afraid to admit that AWD sucks at anything other than getting a good holeshot. Having raced RWDs, AWDs seems unbalanced and lack the "toss-ability" and lightnees of a RWD (even some FWDs like the Integra Type R, given a twisty technical track, a stocker will walk all over a stock or mildly modded Talon).

You see, from where I come from, we go circuit racing/time attacks/hill climbs...not drag runs.

so Vince, before the next time you rear your big fat american ass arrogance (might I add ignorance) again, think first.

Wow, that was harsh

Haha, once again...there is no replacement for displacement. On a 30+ degree day with the A/C on, off the line (with a normal launch) my Talon felt like it had about 20 ft-lbs of torque. This is not so much the fact that it is AWD, but the fact that there is no low end grunt. For turbos, Audi has it right. The S4 made full boost by 1950 rpm and felt more like a big displacement engine than a turbocharged one.

Hey Jeremy I doubt Vince needs any defence cause he is a big boy but three grand and a long weekend gets you the basics for a race licence. There are a lot of guys without one that can drive better than guys who do.

You may be good maybe your not it doesnt matter you like your car and if its FWD then more power to you. I have been driving for 18 years in front/rear/awd on and off the track and if i had to have only two wheels driving it wouldnt be the front.

FWD was introduced not as a performance enhancer it was simply a cost cutting measure and a way to increase interior space. A side benefit was that for the average driver the tendency of FWD to understeer and having weight over the drive wheels made it "easier" to drive. The problem with handling though is the unequal weight distribution and the steering wheels doing double duty as drive wheels.

RWD for someone who knows what they are doing works well as one end pushes and the other steers. The weight is more evenly distributed and provideds better handling. Physics likes this car for the track as weight transfer loads the rears and gets the power to the pavement. But since the engine weight isnt over the drive wheels then traction is limited on slippery surfaces.

AWD has all of the handling and traction benefits of the above its simple math and physics ....but with added complexity and weight. The complexity was a problem in rallying when you had to fix on the fly and the weight was initially a concern on the track. Over the years AWD took over rally and into the Pikes Peak races and into the track taking over group A racing with Archer brothers blowing the doors off of the 300z RX7 and camaros and mustangs. Audi Quattros took over SCCA trans am series against more powerful cars and were hit with all kinds of restrictions and weight penalties so they moved to IMSA GTO. AWD was banned in SCCA because the 2WDs couldnt compete. FWD and RWD over the years have added systems to compensate like traction control or wheelspin control etc to achieve what is a given in AWD.

So all the things you guys are talking about arent drivetrain or vehicle problems they are application or driver preference. As for tossability etc that all has to do with the vehicle set up. So a bunch of amateurs like us should leave the real comparisons to the big boys and everything else is only opinion.

P.S Hey Thomas you still need to get one of those fingers down buddy remember im #1

Jery,

just picture only one

Common Ronnie, I hope your talking about the front wheel !!

& FWD isnt gay, it just needs a liitle help like an old man with a walker getting across the street !

I don;t think Jeremy is saying that AWD talon is boggable but rather easier to bug than a FWD NT,. This is a fact. he Low end toque of NT and Turbo is NOT comparable. the NT with two teeth off timing has more torque than any turbo around before 2000RPM.

and I think juicing out a 16.8 out of a 10 year old Galant with ECS and sh!t(read weight) is not what every clutch dumper could do.

I am Fan of AWD and that is why I have dug the current hole for me. But for any non drag application FWD is fine.

let it be just a bit slippery and FWD eats RWD. This is fact. RWD is a real bitch in snow. FWD is almost as good as AWD.

Hey Thomas, someguy was tell me that you got smoked by a black elantra. Is there any truth to that? I know your car is fast(and loud), i was a victum of a fly-by on Kennedy rd. in scarboro. I always thought that you had the fastest hyundai, i guess i was wrong. Hopefully with that new turbo you got,you can regain your title as ultimate sleeper.

Jeremy please save the tears for someone that cares. You said you couldn't start from a stoplight without bogging your AWD car and I said that if this is the case you don't know how to drive. No need to get your panties all in a bunch, if you don't know how to move your AWD car it's not my problem, just admit it to yourself and move on.

And congratulations on your "advanced licence", but as Jerry already said any tool with 3 grand can get one so it you're trying to impress me try again.

Who's the arogant one Jeremy? "I can drive a lot better than you can ever imagine" now if that isn't arrogant I don't know what is.

Jeremy I really think you picked the wrong car, you are not DSM material, you cry and whine too much to own a DSM, I think a fuel efficient econo box like a Honda is more suited for you. A honda would go great with your "I am the best driver in the world attitude" because we all know honda drivers are full of Sh*t.

For speed thrills,

Give me RWD and a big motor. Turbos optional.

or

Give me a high strung 2-stroke motor on a 2 wheeler.

Ony way to fly.

other wise, give me a reliable, decent powered FWD for the street.

Maybe I'm getting older and my tastes have changed. I find myself liking more comfortable cars. Screw out right performance in a comfortable daily driver (not that it is an exclusive attribute, just expensive). Any mid-size sedan running low 15s high 14s is plenty quick for me. hp and 1/4 mile numbers are just bragging rights..they mean nothing to me.

Thats also the reason why I decided to sell my rather fast stock talon. I dont enjoy driving it..after the novelty wears out, its just another car. Now, if the AWD talon came with a larger engine say a 2.4 with more torque at low RPMs...that would be a different story. Hell, I drove my friend's 160hp non-VTEC prelude and it feels a whole lot faster than my Talon (although I would still trounce him on the track).

Dennis is right, no matter how you put it, if you saddle a heavy powertrain with a tiny motor, something has to give. There is NO replacement for displacement.

and Vince...go ahead and continue to live in that little cave you call a "DSM". Sooner or later you will see the light.

Maybe I am not the driver for a 12 year old car you call a DSM that does nothing well other than going fast in a straight line, good snow traction and gas drinker.

I have better aspirations.

My favourite of the 8 mitsubishi's my family and I have had, is a 1980 Lancer 1.4L with RWD. Not my talon, nor my 2 galants, nor the 3 other lancers and an Evo II.

That was back in 2000 i belive. I lost yes.
My car is nowhere anything close to what it was back then. lucky if i had 250 hp lol. I wanted to race him again but he wouldnt race me. Best he ran was a 13.8 i belive on drag radials.He wanted to race me on a roll though. But yeah the elantra is fast, if u see him u will know, big NIZZTEX sticker on the rear bumper. But yeah i wanted to race him last year and i was told he doesnt want to run me again. I think it would be a diff out come this time around and they know i guess.

Me fly by? Hmmm

I remember a topic started by Thomas Toth months ago. I blieve it was asking people for their opinions on if he should convert to awd. So awd sucks eh?

oh ya, you flew by me alright. thanks for staightening me out. i knew things didn't sound right. that guy only had a 16g and stock ic. i saw the car the other day, the guy that bought the turbo from me brings his car to Nizztex. the elantra had the motor pulled, but i'm not sure what he's getting done.

No offense, but as far as Im concerned "FWD" and "PERFORMANCE" don't even belong in the same sentences together.

An AWD can do anything a FWD can, better. When your FWD plows, you're fucked... at least with RWD and AWD you have the option (if you're making any decent amount of power) to kick the rear end out at will. If I can do it in my crippled AWD Talon, then anyone should be able to. Complaining about understeer should be against the law. It's easily remedied in an AWD car. FWD only gives you direct control of the front wheels, they do the pulling and the turning. AWD and RWD give you control of all 4 corners and leave a lot more room for suspension and tuning on the road course... you're not limited like in a FWD car.

Having the options, I absolutely can't comprehend why anyone would choose a FWD over RWD or AWD... it just makes no sense.

Did i anywhere say AWD sucks? This thread started as a joke from the fishing guy. I replied with stupid usless replies knowing this is a TEST section.People need to relax eh.

Would i like my car AWD? well DUH ! Will it ever be? who knows

Actually what I heard is that he ran a 12.8

I would like to line up against him one more time as well. No sure what will happen, he should be pushing close to 300whp in a 2600lb car...

All this bitching about whats better, whose faster, blablabla. I can solve this problem right now, how many exotic cars out there are FWD? That's right, NONE. Reason? FWD sucks. Problem solved, lets get back to peace and love.

as FWD fan I should add FWD was not come into existance for "PERFORMANCE" reasons.

it is not to be a Sport car's platform

But it has its own performance adavtanges. For example it has better performance in snow.

but this only a words game.

This downside is very true and noticable when it is about drag racing but indeed less of disadvantage or even a partial advantage when it is about highspeed highway racing.

for a car to just drive around indeed FWD is better than RWD. AWD is tractionally better but more costly.