Yes, that is also true.
I paid $600, and I'm not sure if I really got anything for it, or a mild internal porting, if I trust what is said 100%.

The one thing I have not heard back on, is the measured dimensions. Magnus has been very quiet since I sent those dimensions...

I'm not saying that in itself is any admission of anything, but does anyone out there have access to a stock 2G head, that could take some quick measurements?

Then we'd know, once and for all.

I talked to Marco at CSCS about this whole thread. He wasnt too impressed. Ive always known him to be a great guy to deal with. Never had any problems. Thumbs up from me!!

Did you expect him to be impressed?

Is it possible that they just smoothed/removed the casting marks/ridges inside the mani?
Different "levels" of porting get diffrent "levels" of porting...

I've known Marco for a approx. 10 years and although he is not cheap...everthing that he has ever done to my car has been of good quality and never have had to been replaced.

If I could just stop having other drivers stop writing off my cars I could test the longevity of the parts installed...

Again, 600 dollers later...

Like I said he isn't cheap.

By the time you charge labour for removal/reinstall(if that was done), return shipping to/from the shop, the cost of the porting labour itself...
$600 doesn't sound that bad, does it???

Although I have absolutly no idea what a "Basic", "Mid" and "Extreme" porting job costs...

I've said what I wanted to say, I will step back for now.

Yeah, and his coffee is bad too and he's always out of smokes.

Just so no one thinks the Moderators are ganging up on Marco here I have had several dealings with Magnus and have been pleased with the results.

Magnus has a business to run, and Magnus doesn't live by the computer.

Just mentioning that I have been quiet means nothing, and just by mentioning it you are insinuating something. You could have easily left that out of your post. Bienhaus, you and I don't talk for good reason, as you have shown here in this post.

YOU STILL HAVE NO CLUE WHAT A PORTED HEAD LOOKS LIKE, YET YOU ARE STILL CHIRPING.

The mechanical ineptitude of the people on this board is staggering. Most if not all of you have no idea what porting involves. If you think that "hogging" out a port is the only way to make power then you are all as lost as your fearless leader.

The reason people come to me is because I have the experience and the answers. Look at all you pathetic sheep jumping on Andy's bandwagon, yet you guys couldn't tell the difference between your asshole from an elbow in this situation. None of you have an inkling of the facts at ALL, but you ASSUME that I ripped Andy off, because it is not what you "IMAGINED".

Why don't you guys go and build your fast cars with your imagination, and I'll go back to work on real machines, making real hp, with real measured gains, like a true professional.

Andrew, why would you not just go to marco and talk to him 1on1 about it in the frist place? Im sure he would help you out. But by posting **** about him was not gonna help you out now.

I been to Magnus before and hes been helping me out on my car.

If i had a problem with him, I would frist talk to him about it and not post **** on this "bad guy topic" like most dumbes on this site.

Its just funny how everyone tags along with everyone else not even knowing the full story or the person at all.

"Its just funny how everyone tags along with everyone else not even knowing the full story or the person at all."

Could be said for either side here, don't you think?

Which is EXACTLY why we only want people who are directly involved posting here.

Something a LOT of people seem to have overlooked.

Marco: if you're done I'll just lock it.

"FIGHT FIGHT FIGHT!!!!"

"I think Andrew should take a trip to the shop and have a word with Marco."

"You do have a point Andrew.

This Topic is good/bad guy

And if you think he is a bad guy then yo have all the rights to post here"

"bring the head to the machine shop and ask them"

"well this is a post no?

your asking him to do a search and this is one"

We get it already Rick :rolleyes: . Please, you've stated your opinion and a couple past experiences, now move on.

YES SIRRRRRRRR

next time ill just ****ing read and not post.

SORRY MISTER

Thanks. We appreciate it.

Marco I had nothing good to say about you. Bought products and you gave me good deals and followup on warrenty repairs. Now I have to say you are rude. Generalizations and blanket statements go nowhere fast. I am sure you and Andy can work this out off the board. I can see how you would be frustrated and I usually keep my opinions to myself but dont come and call us sheep or mechanically inepit. Once again I say all my experience with you has been great. Keep up good work and good luck getting everything sorted out.

I agree with you Nathan, this guy is rude as hell. How does this guy run a business with that kind of attitude?

"...like a true professional."


Uh huh. ok.

Ok, well, at this point, there is no point Marco.
You're not going to cough up the $600, and I'm certainly NOT paying you to Re&Re the head, yet again.

And for those who compared $$$ to $$$... that $600 was in addition to the re&re.
All in all, that visit to Marco's shop cost me some $6500.

And, true to the advice I try and pass on here, it was well detailed, and documented ahead of time. It still went $2k over, and the words I got on the phone when it was done were (and I quote):
"It's done, come get your f*cking car, I'm tired of it taking up space in my shop."

Now, anyone who knows Marco, can take that with a grain of salt, and laugh it off.

However, the LAST word anyone would ever use is "professional". I think other words used here like "rude", pretty well summ it up.


I still have no word from Marco on the actual size I should be seeing at the ports, even under his magically-scientific-dyno-special port job.

And, that's NOT to poke fun... but come up with the numbers Marco. I think every PRO out there will agree, that there should not be a 1/4" STEP DOWN (as in 90-degree, sharp corner step) from the intake manifold runner, into the head.

Magic special port or not, that's just wrong.
Plain wrong.
3 different tuners/shops now, with more years in this game than you, agree. (but who will not post, because they are afraid of feeling the rant of Marco)

-shrug-

Hey, when I am wrong, I'm happy to admit it.
I said, I could be wrong.
But no proof yet seems to surface that I am.
My facts seem to stand...

You guys want to talk about history?
I've got lots.

Things marco did for the car, and the long-term result (good and bad):

- 3" exhaust - sweet job, only melted front gaskets, but I fixed that.
- custom o2 housing, with ext wg mount -very pretty welds, but the whole thing dropped off the car (inferior weld, engineer certified)
- koni shocks, good.
- rear strut tower bar, good, although I had to put the covers back on
- Apexi SuperITC, install ok, but twisted together wires, wrapped in black electrical tape seemed to suffice, rather than crimps, or solder.
- magnus sheet metal intake, leaked like a sieve, had no place to mount half the stuff, and had a 1/4" plate for the TB end, whose threads were stripped. (prototype, alpha test, to be sure) he offered to fix, at my cost of re&re.
- timing belt job, done very nicely. one seal leaked badly, and after some pressure, he changed it out with no charge.
- aem rotors, very nice, but abs stopped working. was willing to look at, for $$$.
- fmic, good install, one of the first things marco did, and it's still on there
- port head, to go with magnus intake and well ported exhaust manifold, well that you know.
- install 20G, worked ok, after some adjustments, and welding on the outlet
- probably a few other minor things...
- rescued me from a dead engine fuse, all the way out in Cambridge.

The last one, was the one that got me started. That was the Marco of the good heart.
There are two or three sides to Marco, and I wish I saw more of that one from many moons ago.
Many of us do...

But, I'm sorry Marco, I will not just shut up, like everyone else. I will not bash words around, like the "arrogant asshole" you keep labelling me as... but I also will not roll over and just lie here silently.


I spent the last 45 mins answering emails from people who just want me to ban you for your arrogance and rudeness. I have refused, and instead suggested they list their own stories here.
I think too many people have wanted to stay your friend, rather than get a fair shake.

And before you assume you'll never get it on here... look around. Read some of the other posts in here. The IAC one comes to mind... we heard one side, and then the other, and it seems like the truth lies somewhere imbetween.

Here, all we've heard is arrogance, suggesting that you are all knowing, and all seeing... infoulable to the end. That we know nothing, and are all idiots, because we don't choose to work on cars for a living.
That, simply isn't the case.
And, you aren't the only game in town, either.

You may not like that the internet is here, and I am posting this. But, you've got some business from here, I am sure... so...

'he who lives by the sword...'

Nicely done. Marco is starting to sound like IAC (International Automotive and Customs). Well now theres two shops off my list.

Things we can learn about porting:

1. Research the topic, confirm what you're looking to accomplish, and that the shop doing the porting, understands this.
2. Ask to inspect the head upon return from porting.
3. Confirm that the head has been properly flushed, or that it's part of the re&re. (another member lost a turbo, likely due to extrude hone abrasive left in oil passages)
4. Provide parts and/or gaskets that will mate up to head ports.
5. Always use new gaskets, and new bolts (where stretch fit is required, ie: torque spec is XX ft-lbs, plus YY degrees aditional)
6. Inquire as to warranty, what it covers, and what it does not.

I'll never understand retailors who attack thier customers with generalizations and rude comments. Do you realize these are the people that buy your product? Not so professional.

Use common sence when you post, these are the people that will bring thier cars to you, these people aren't far away and are never going to utilize your services, they are your service customer base.

Read the posts before you jump to reply, what you responded to the person complaing about the clutch job was not coherant in the least, it's obvious you diden't even read the post, you must have been too busy getting out the Thesaurus to form your ever so "professional" responces.

You've lost more then one customer becasue of your poor attitude and rudeness. I'll avoid lecturing you on business paractices but step back from your ego and take a page from the most basic of business texts; customer service sells products.

Jesse, you are not adding anything to the conversation please stop posting in this thread.

Guys it's not that hard.

I'm sorry you never approached me on this subject right off the bat regardiong this matter instead of taking it to YOUR forum.

You should know me well enough that if we get into a war of words I am not going to back down.

If this was a problem with my business you should have taken it up with Magnus. Instead by looking at your last post it is obvious that you are taking this to a personal level. As you know I am a busy guy I have no more time for this he said she said stuff, there is no more evidence to your accusations now then there were before. I am a busy guy I'm going to work.

Magnus is Marco. Marco is Magnus.
I should drive an hour and a half, to be laughed at and called an idiot?


For facts, I thought this was quite clear...
Nothing personal, except that you controlled every part of the transaction and the work, personally. So, that does make you personally responsible, no?

And hey, not MY forum.
And I wasn't looking for a war of words, you created that.
I presented facts, and you called us all idiots.
I presented possibilities, and you told us we didn't know what we were talking about.
I made suggestions to check, and you called me an arrogant asshole.

-shrug-

Seems pretty one-sided to me.

"I'll be brief..."
The first words of the first post of this thread.....

The way I see it:
There are 3 angles here - Andrew, the engine head (only if it could talk) and Magnus/Marco.

Andrew, you should have brought the head to Magnus. Walked in and asked Marco on the spot if it was ported or not. I'm sure Marco would have given you a honest answer. With either answer, you would have the facts for all parties involved and could have taken it from there.

Slamming each other in a public form doesn't solve anything..

For now you guys have to agree to disagree. There is too much **** going on in this world for all this negavity.

Disclaimer: I have no beef against Andrew and Marco has always been honest with me.

Yup Doug, I wish I could believe that were true.

And, I wish the head were off the car, and then I would indeed be standing on his doorstep.

But, it's not coming off now, I don't have the time, and I'm NOT taking my freshly reassembled, cleaned, polished and detailed car to sit in his smoke-filled shop again, until the snow flies, and paying him to re&re it.

So, all I can do, is go by pictures and carefully taken measurements, and the words of other professionals in the industry, and my fellow club member's experience.

The last of which, I truly believe, collectively, has more experience than any mechanic. No, most of us aren't rocket scientists like Marco, individually, but collective experience, beats one person's opinion, just about every time.

I know Marco has done well by you, but you're also close by him. It's easy to just drop in for adjustments, ask questions, or check on progress through a project. And he knows that.

The last time I picked it up, I had to take a trailer to haul it home.
The time before that, I took a BUS all the way there from Hamilton, only to find it wasn't ready. (even though I was assured it was)

Frankly, I'd get no where going to see him.
We both know that.
We both know Marco hates me at his core, for private reasons that don't need discussing here. There are things he blames me for, that are simply a result of his own poor management, and have no more to do with me, than you do.

For those reasons, I stopped trying to get Marco to fix things, years ago, and just resigned myself to fixing things myself.
Frankly, that's part of the reason the car was off the road for 3.5 years.
This was just the icing on the cake...
I had always had suspicians about this or that, but always wrote them off as just "how marco does business", and accepted it as a "known factor" if you go to him.

But this, struck me as the first time I really felt like I had been blatantly ripped off.

I still have no evidence to the contrary, other than his rather "inelequent" word.


Hey Doug, I appreciate you stepping up, and giving him props, but maybe it's better if you put that in a fresh "Marco = Good Guy" post.


I'm not here to alienate anyone, just to either prove me wrong, or help others watch out in the future.
It's the same as any other good-guy, bad-guy posting.


Last thought... I'd LOVE TO BE PROVEN wrong.
As sure as I am sitting here.
I was just confessing that to Steve an hour ago.
If I am wrong, I have a good ported head on my DSM, and I am happy.
But if I am right, I've got some incorrectly matched head, or a head that isn't ported at all... and I LOSE OUT.

I really REALLY REALLY don't WANT to be right.
Someone, please prove me wrong...

I think its time to close the thread guys. This is going no were.
Maybe you should look at the head on a flow bench, and you should have done this BEFORE saying its not ported. That will decide once and for all if it is ported.

Ugh.
Please, people, stay out... or at least read through the facts first.

The thread will be closed, I guess, at this point, when we get firm confirmation of stock 2G port sizes.

You know what?
This whole thread has me so upset, I just yelled at my Son.

That's not right.

I've had it.
I don't want any money.
I never wanted compensation Marco.
I don't want anything more from anyone, except the facts.


I want to know if I need to remove my head again this winter, and have it ported properly.
Any measurements that can help in this regard, would be appreciated.

Good call on closing the thread, its getting lengthy and pointless.
Re-opening it once final measurements, etc...are done needs to be done.
I think its important for both parties involved to have the results posted to clear this up.

It's only a car...go apologize to your son! I am confident someone will get those sizes eventually...and in the meantime there is nothing more to be done anyways...

Facts in Review:
---------------

I've now got some hard numbers, from a stock 2G head.
While they aren't a perfect match to mine (some are slightly larger, some are slightly smaller), the tolerances on the measuring technique, put them close enough to say that my ports were not touched at the flanges -- intake or exhaust.
Casting marks from the factory around the inside of the flange edges, support this fact as well.

---

The manifolds that mate to these surfaces, that were onhand and available at the time of porting, do NOT mate to these ports.
- a well ported 2G exhaust manifold, and a magnus sheet metal intake
- manifold openings are larger in all aspects, as much as 1/4" difference/radius in some cases
ie: the holes in the head, were SMALLER.

---

Professional shops, (who prefer to remain unnamed, but are at the level of a Buschur, Magnus or Sheppard in the DSM/import community), all indicate that in addtion to any internal flow/velocity porting, head ports should match the devices being attached to them, OR AT LEAST should not introduce a hard step down in size in the airflow.
(as very clearly absolutely without question happened here)

---

Magnus Motorsports reports, in no uncertain terms, that the head was indeed sent out and ported.
Additionally, they have suggested that proper porting does not always require touching the flange areas, and is mostly internal.

---

The Logic:
---------

Since I do trust Magnus at their word, there is only one common set of conclusions we can logically draw:

1a. The sub-contract port shop were not instructed correctly on the parts they were porting for, and were not given manifolds or gaskets.

--or--

1b. The sub-contract port shop was so instructed, but did not do it correctly.

---and---

2a. Magnus Motorsports did not check the ported head correctly for component/port match, before final assembly.

--or--

2b. Magnus Motorsports believes that mis-matched ports are the correct way to put an engine together.

----

Conclusions:
-----------
Responsibility for sub-contracted work, falls to the company delivering the final product, therefore any blame on the port shop from here, is moot.
The bottom line word from Magnus is that some porting was indeed done, but we can see that it was not done correctly.
Magnus Motorsports either made a mistake, or was simply incorrect in an engine assembly technique.


I don't believe there are any other variables to consider. I shouldn't be the one closing this case, but with all of the possible variables covered, logic seems to speak for itself.

So, let's leave it alone.
Any further comments should be directed to either myself or one of the moderators, and we will happily entertain any other missing pieces of data.

If and when the actual head in question is ever removed from the car, I will provide a written report, from a reputable machine&port shop.

Again, just to help another club member in the future, and avoid a similar headache:

Things we can learn about porting:

1. Research the topic, confirm what you're looking to accomplish, and that the shop doing the porting, understands this.
2. Ask to inspect the head upon return from porting.
3. Confirm that the head has been properly flushed, or that it's part of the re&re. (another member lost a turbo, likely due to extrude hone abrasive left in oil passages)
4. Provide parts and/or gaskets that will mate up to head ports.
5. Always use new gaskets, and new bolts (where stretch fit is required, ie: torque spec is XX ft-lbs, plus YY degrees aditional)
6. Inquire as to warranty, what it covers, and what it does not.