Surplus as in calorie surplus? Cause if so I was at an extreme deficit (12-1500 calories per day, tops, on average and less regularly) and still gaining muscle/losing weight and I lift big/am not small. I did eventually get to a point where that slowed down but that's where those cheat days helped - got my body energized and feeling good again and I was probably also mentally recharged after such large calorie deficits over weeks at a time. Going hard on a large deficit was physically and mentally challenging; would definitely recommend a good workout buddy if you go this route.

As for the last part - it's my experience only. My body is weird in many ways but I did find that to be the case (for me). I've read other people mention similar but I also know people who it didn't apply to.

Pretty impressive that you were at a deficit like that and was still able to put on muscle. I have done one quick bulk in my life and when I cut back down (using IF not Keto) I lost everything I gained in both fat and muscle.

What was your sleep like then? I think if your diet and sleep is in check you can still go hard but my sleep hasn't been great though I have really stepped up my quality of food.

I should see where my calories are at these days, I doubt I am where you were but I am pretty sure I am under 2000.

My sleep schedule was pretty bad - I would get up at the same time everyday but when I would go to sleep would vary. I probably averaged 4-5 hours of sleep per night.

My body type is nice in that I can put on muscle easily (and keep most of it while cutting) but that means I also put on fat incredibly easily. I gain weight like it's nobody's business

That's alright.

I think you are doomed no matter what type you have. Everything for me is very slow and have had to try multiple different types of routines to get me to grow and get stronger

It would be alright if I didn't love to eat as much as I do...would be nice to be able to eat a lot and not have to worry about whether my pants are going to fit or not but I recognize the struggle that people like that have with gaining strength and putting on muscle so I can't complain too much.

Yeah one of my cousins is a lot like you. Hadn't seen him in just over a year and he put on a sh!t load of mass and fat all at once.

Now that I have figured out how to get past plateaus I really don't mind anymore but when I was younger and would sit at one for a year it was extremely frustrating.

I've done a lot of reading on the Ketogenic Diet/LCHF, especially a couple books by Drs. Phinney and Volek. Apparently carb ups can hinder fat adaption which allows you to perform as well or even better then when on a high carb diet.

For me, I feel like crap when I carb load, tired, digestion problems, poor performance in the gym, etc.
I just prefer to stick with and stay and Ketosis. I spent so long of my life on a crappy diet and I don't want to feel like that ever again.

Well boys I finally finished Project MASS!!
Pretty happy with the results, I certainly feel better and look leaner and larger but unfortunately have not been able to locate our scale so have no idea how much weight I have put on.

I have decided to go back to strength training now so I am back on 5/3/1, I had a goal of hitting a 300lb bench and would like to do it while staying around 10% body fat (which should be around 165-170ish, but am just guess until I weigh myslef) the way the program progresses it will take me about a year to get there, assuming I don't hit a plateau.

Also got some sweet new equipment for the gym!
I picked up some chains so I can do some progressive loading and also picked up stall mats so the floor is now covered in rubber, I thought I would be using bare feet after that but it's super heavy rubber so not the most comfortable to walking on but deadlifts and dropping weights aren't an issue anymore.

After doing a cycle of 5/3/1 (3 weeks) and doing a bunch of reading I have decided to jump on the sheiko train.
This is my first week and it's very punishing!! I have a good friend that came to workout with me and recommended it and who in one cycle put on 15lbs to each of his lifts. Frequency of workouts is less, 3 days, but frequency of the big lifts is much greater. I am doing squats or a variation 3 days a week as well as bench or a variation all the 3 days as well.

Here is a very detailed review if anyone is interested.
http://www.powerliftingtowin.com/sheiko/

There's such a thing as squatting less than 3 days per week!? Who knew

What kind of numbers are you working at on the big 3 lifts? PR's?

Haha, my buddy is doing squat everyday right now and he said first two weeks were brutal, is that what you are doing?

Bench 265, Squat 365, Dead 395 right now I am at 165ish. All the work in sheiko on normal weeks is above 80% of PR, I am in deload/rampup (sheiko 29) week so there is intensity is lower.

Respectable numbers! I am admittedly not that advanced. What are your targets?

I've been squatting 3x/week for years.. but I am somewhat injury-averse so my progression has been very slow, I'm about 1plate less than you on every lift.

Thank you very much! My plan is to stick with sheiko till I hit 300 on the bench and would like to keep my weight under 175. Also would like to get 405 on the squat and 455 on dead, I don't really concentrate on those two as I have never hit a plateau in either so any advancement I would be happy with.
Sheiko also has a classification system based on your big 3 total and weight. I would like to move up in that to candidate for master of sport, for that I have to stay under 180 and lift at least 1243. I have no plans to weigh more than 180 though as that's getting a little to big for me so will be staying in this weight class.

I messed my should a really long time ago and it comes back to haunt me once in a while which is why I think my bench has been so slow to progress.

Do you have any targets? What do you weigh in at?

My targets are basically your current PR's That's not a joke either
I tend to revolve between muay thai and lifting and have a hard time doing both with equal intensity - so often I stray from dedicated lifting. Accordingly, my weight varies from 160-180, depending on my focus; obviously lighter if I'm training muay thai and heavier when I lift. If I could ever have a 1000lb total I'd be satisfied with that!

A 265lb bench is nothing to be ashamed of. Squat and dead for your weight are quite good also. Are you high bar or low bar? Squatting below parallel? Sumo or conventional dead? Do you ever clean? It's taken me FOREVER to get decent clean form and I'm still sucking much more than I ought considering how much time I've put in

It's definitely doable! Yeah that's fair I have never really had anything that I have been as interested in as I have with lifting, my bag will be going up soon so will get to focus on some kickboxing. Yeah super pumped I hit 1000!! it's been a big goal for me.

Honestly I am just happy that my bench progresses now, I spend 3+ years stuck at 225 while both my dead and squat continued to rise and it was super frustrating. Thanks you appreciate it! I am high bar, ass to the grass and conventional. I have done cleans in the past but none recently, supposedly sheiko has some clean work in it but have gotten to it yet so we shall see, cleans are rough so I definitely hear you there when I was doing them I never got over 1 plate and got exhausted really fast!

I'll be starting a more dedicated exercise regiment/diet soon. Bought exercising equipment, membership to the local pool. Hopefully get back into martial arts when my joints feel up to it

Want to lose weight for the cars too, can't all be on them to take the heat!

Doubt I can reach my 50kg competing weight (for Judo tourneys) but I'm aiming for 55-60 currently 79.

Anyone have tricks to lean out muscles? Mine got too bulky from construction, can't wear a lot of the shirts/jackets I loved. Well not unless I want to rip them while moving lol

I heard yoga...but really don't want to go that route if I don't need to. My physio told me the pool would be good for sure.

Yeah your going to just have to do a sh!t load of cardio if you want to shed was and not keep on the muscle.

Yeah physio said pool/dancing/yoga/cycling. I'm all good for everything but the yoga.

Anything I should try to avoid eating not to help muscles over-develop?

As long as you are just eating natural foods you should be good. Try to stick with clean fats and veggies and keep your protein to 1g per lb of body weight.

It's the wintertime, bulk while you can. Start cutting in the spring.

Yoga is great for meeting women, don't knock it till ya try it!

So how's everyone's goals coming along~!?

I finished my first round of sheiko and am pretty happy with the results, unfortunately I ran out of time on wednesday so I had to move my deadlift test which I think messed me up for my results.

I am now at 265 bench, 385 squat and 395 dead, also these are actuals, I used to use calculated maxes which I have put a stop too as with weights like these I could end up hurting myself.
For this next circuit I would like to get my bench up another 20 if I can, would like to hit 405 with the squat and deadlift. If I am right I think my deadlift didn't move because I did it today instead of wednesday, if that's true then I may see an even bigger move than just 405 which I am obviously hoping for.

I'm coming along.

I had to take a month or so off after a surgery to fix my hearing, wasn't allowed to lift anything over 5 lbs.

I was down to 215 but I've put a bit back on - I'm 228 as of this AM. Weird thing is I look leaner in certain spots (expect my damned belly!).
Still doing the Keto diet, absolutely love it and have never felt better in my life - all the weird little issues I've dealt with over the years are gone now.

Was doing a 5x5 program for a couple months and now I'm starting into PHAT training (higher volume which my body responds to better).
Before Christmas I did a 320 lbs Deadlift so I was pleased with that.

That's good stuff, for pinch test all my fat is on my legs and my belly.

Nice work!! That's good progress!

So Ill jump in here now..
We have a fat burning contest at work.
6 weeks ago I weighed in at 224 and a body fat % of 26.5
Last week I weighed 205 and a body fat% of 21!

Me and Sandra are doing the 21day fix... its a px90sorta thing.

Remember this is sorta long over due recovery from blood clot and a sever damaged lung.

its not easy!

You're doing good Jay! We all start somewhere

Good to see this thread still going.

After taking six months off to recuperate from injuries and spend time with my kids, I have returned to the gym since beginning of March.

Was really sore for the first few times, but I'm starting to get back to my regular weight lifting.

I'd like to get to 350 for my bench and hit 70 for my single curls by end of the year...but we'll see where my spotting partners are.

I did a lot of isometrics in the off time...very interesting stuff.

And now it's hard core stretching for the summer football season.

I need to keep up with the 20 year olds! LOL

damn son 350!! How much you weigh, what's your current bench at?

Lol I will be 29 this year so want to keep the momentum up so I don't start slipping in my 30s

Hey hey...those of us in our 30s aren't that bad...

Bryan...
Let's just say I started lifting my first weight before you were born.

If you keep up with it, you can make lots of gains.
You just need more TLC afterwards (stretch, protein, proper foods, jump rope, isometrics etc).

I'm about 255lbs...wish I could eat better, but the kids are first priority (I have four).

Don't believe ANYONE who says you can't improve your physical condition past 40.

Haha wow good stuff that you keep it up. Ok maybe I will get into a habit like that now so I don't have issues in the future, I currently deal with light knee pain and random shots of pain in my back (this one is new, happened twice in the past few months)

Yeah we are on our first right now. The wife has been doing a fantastic job on dinner this past few weeks cause she wants to get healthier so it's been great, I have no problem keeping my meals in check when I am at work, it's when I am at home that I start having issues.

Good to know!! I always worry that once I get there progression will be very slow.

I wish I still had n00b gains like when I first started working out.

Hell even fat loss is crazy slow these days.

Haha, I still get noob gains sometimes when I change up my program, obviously not like I did back then but still some pretty good jumps.

What program are you doing these days?

I am on my second round of sheiko, will be testing again in 4 weeks.

What are you doing now?

I'm doing Layne Norton's PHAT right now.
Loving it, my body seems to respond well to training 5 times a week and varying load.

Interesting, if you like that program you should really check out project mass. Very similar concept except 3 days strength, rest, 3 days hypertrophy, rest and repeat. At first it was weird having my work out days change but you get into the rhythm

One of the reasons I can still do the weight is in large part due to my Chiropractor.

He's been able to change the way I do things so that I can continue to make gains and deal with my age.

Your pains worry me.
I crippled myself at age 23 in a plain era of stupidity. Took years to heal.
Get yourself checked out and ensure that when you're 50, the young ladies are still checking you out.

There's an interesting study going on that tracked families of weight lifters. They said it only takes a lazy generation to lose the benefits your genes have built up by being active.

They also point out that most of these people were highly active until a life changing incident. And the fact that they were active kept them alive. AND life expectancy is higher.

So keep on the health track...but know when to hit the pit stop!

Yeah and I also have a shoulder injury that seems to disappear and come back randomly. I should also add that I think this is an issue with rotary cuff in total as all my issues surround my should and are not just in one area, I have started physio on it and it seems to be getting better but it's a slow process, and I also have the bad habit of stopping the exercises as soon as everything feels great.

Yeah it's been a while since I have done a checkup like that so probably a good idea if I do.

I'm still working on cutting down (forever cut hahaha) so it'll be the fall/winter before I worry about bulking up/putting on mass.
I have noticed a nice recomp effect with my diet/training though.
I'll check that out though.



Gotta check your ego at the door!
I find this is hard regardless of age, I've got to tell myself sometimes to back down so I don't hurt myself (again).
I shagged up my knee last year (muscle imbalance and my patella slips out of place when bending my knee), dear god that was the worst pain I've ever had.
It's slowly getting better but no where near normal. Physio and stretching has helped a bit - I also get massages fairly often.
Thinking about trying yoga a couple times on my off week.

Oddest thing, my knee feels 100% when I've got 225lbs on my back doing ass to grass squats lol.

I leaned out during project mass, I think the best part is the diet he perscribes in that program is less strict than what you are doing so you will fit in well. The guy that created this program pushes keto a lot so you guys would get a long well, haha.

Ego used to be an issue for me, I always tried to push when I was failing, now I just drop it cause I would rather not injur myself.
sh!t that sounds painful!!

The say that the key to keeping your knees safe!