Re: Who runs Holset
[Re: ruben silva]
#365772
November 30, 2011 08:46 pm UTC
November 30, 2011 08:46 pm UTC
|
Joined: May 2003
Posts: 7,263 Niagara Falls, Ontario
Ziggy Dietrich
Senior Member, with Far TOO Much Time on Their Hands
|
Senior Member, with Far TOO Much Time on Their Hands
Joined: May 2003
Posts: 7,263
Niagara Falls, Ontario
|
There is actually a Holset forum started on the RTM forums, as there has been some interest in these. Most holset guys want -12 an return lines, which we are now prepared to offer. We are also planning to make the restricted -4an feed lines, just don't know yet what size the restrictor is supposed to be..
"bluebird" worlds fastest scooter ridden by me "Whitebird" RIP
|
|
|
Re: Who runs Holset
[Re: Ziggy Dietrich]
#365773
November 30, 2011 09:47 pm UTC
November 30, 2011 09:47 pm UTC
|
Joined: Nov 2009
Posts: 2,940 Toronto, Ontario, Canada
Michael Lee
Insane Member
|
Insane Member
Joined: Nov 2009
Posts: 2,940
Toronto, Ontario, Canada
|
Alright, just about done. The next part was hooking up the oil lines. Oiling is a very tricky issue with the Holsets much like the aftermarket Garrett journal bearing turbos that people install. Depending on where you feed the oil from, how adequate your oil return line is, and how much crank case pressure you have, you can end up with too much oil pressure in the turbo which will blow the seals and kill a brand new turbo FAST! (Just ask Wes from LADSM). =P I already had a -4AN oil feed line from the oil filter housing (OFH) for my 16g. The OFH provides clean oil in comparrison to the stock feed location off the head, but it also sends a lot higher oil pressure, especially if you've removed the balance shafts like I did. The answer to this is a restrictor. I bought a simple .075" -4AN billet inline oil restrictor on eBay. I installed it right at the oil filter housing. Not sure, but the author of the writeup in the link provided by Andrew writes the above.
Last edited by Michael Lee; November 30, 2011 09:48 pm UTC.
1997 Eclipse GST/X Eat in small amounts. Otherwise be prepared to paint toilet bowls~ Mike Eng
|
|
|
Re: Who runs Holset
[Re: ruben silva]
#365781
November 30, 2011 11:30 pm UTC
November 30, 2011 11:30 pm UTC
|
Joined: May 2010
Posts: 1,106 Saskatoon, Saskatchewan
Andrew Trapp
Serious Member
|
Serious Member
Joined: May 2010
Posts: 1,106
Saskatoon, Saskatchewan
|
^ If not considered too small by some. There is many a posts about it on dsm tuners (garret owners, your drain may be too small, or something like that). -10 AN does certainly seem to be sufficient, -12 AN seems ideal, -14 AN is what Holset "officially" recommends. -10 AN you are typically okay to get a bolt on fitting for the oil pan, I think Ziggy currently has everything you need for a -10 AN setup. Once you go -12 AN, you need to weld the oil pan, preferably, or get creative.
Holsets love high volume, low(er) pressure.
The main problem with the restrictor is the size you need is going to differ from car to car. The only way to be sure is to do as Clint did - put a gauge at the turbo and measure it. I think it was Paul Volk who did a write up on how to use nitrous jet nozzles to be a restrictor in an AN fitting. Basically the nozzles come in all different orifice sizes and to change the restrictor all you have to do is swap out the nozzle. Otherwise, start somewhat small and just keep drilling it out until you get the desired pressure you are after. Again, the restrictor is going to differ from car to car, start small, see what your pressure is and start increasing to match the Holset spec. For somebody trying to help out Holset users, it might be worth looking into creating a kit similar to what Paul Volk did with the nitrous nozzles. That way, if they do anything that might change their oil pressure (port the oil relief, change oil weight, balance shafts, etc...) or oil needs (change turbo). I'll have to search for it, but from the top of my head, it was a male fitting with the cone cut off and the jet nozzle fit inside the cut off end and had the same degree of cone as the AN fittings.
If you want to guarantee no problems, -12 AN. If you are willing to risk a very low chance, maybe 2% from the posts over at tuners, of something going wrong, go -10 AN. As long as you nail the pressure to within spec, you'll be having a happy turbo.
Last edited by Andrew Trapp; November 30, 2011 11:35 pm UTC.
|
|
|
Re: Who runs Holset
[Re: ruben silva]
#365788
December 01, 2011 12:11 am UTC
December 01, 2011 12:11 am UTC
|
Joined: May 2003
Posts: 7,263 Niagara Falls, Ontario
Ziggy Dietrich
Senior Member, with Far TOO Much Time on Their Hands
|
Senior Member, with Far TOO Much Time on Their Hands
Joined: May 2003
Posts: 7,263
Niagara Falls, Ontario
|
The lines will be going into the store soon. We are creating the restriction by plugging the 90 degree fitting at the filter housing with a pipe plug, so perhaps we could offer the pipe plugs drilled to different sizes. I see the .075 mentioned, what are other people using?
I DO have all the parts for the -12an return now, but it DOES require some welding to the oil pan. The stock Mitsu return will not work well with -12an or 3/4 NPT. Currently we are suggesting a 3/4 NPT female bung be welded to the pan.
Ruben, The codes are VERY hard to read, yet I still get at least 3 robots a day signing up. If you call me when you are ready to sign up (but not tonight anymore please), I can change the "captcha" thing to be much simpler to read....
"bluebird" worlds fastest scooter ridden by me "Whitebird" RIP
|
|
|
Re: Who runs Holset
[Re: ruben silva]
#365797
December 01, 2011 02:34 pm UTC
December 01, 2011 02:34 pm UTC
|
Joined: May 2003
Posts: 7,263 Niagara Falls, Ontario
Ziggy Dietrich
Senior Member, with Far TOO Much Time on Their Hands
|
Senior Member, with Far TOO Much Time on Their Hands
Joined: May 2003
Posts: 7,263
Niagara Falls, Ontario
|
Ruben, you missed the part where you have to sign up with your real name, just like here....afraid you are going to have to do it again . Call me if you need me to make the code simpler to see temporarily...
"bluebird" worlds fastest scooter ridden by me "Whitebird" RIP
|
|
|
Re: Who runs Holset
[Re: ruben silva]
#365831
December 01, 2011 10:12 pm UTC
December 01, 2011 10:12 pm UTC
|
Joined: Dec 2006
Posts: 1,287 ontario
Sven Hebbard
Serious Member
|
Serious Member
Joined: Dec 2006
Posts: 1,287
ontario
|
okay, your right on that rob, But We are talking about a turbo, My hy35 could probably get it close to that 10 second mark,A hx-40 without some serious motor behind it is just gonna be laggy as hell, Better would be to put a hx-35w on there get a stage 3-5 dss axles, stage 2 tranny from shep with lsd, some slicks and then your ready to throw down.
Last edited by Sven Hebbard; December 01, 2011 10:14 pm UTC.
|
|
|
Re: Who runs Holset
[Re: ruben silva]
#365843
December 02, 2011 02:06 am UTC
December 02, 2011 02:06 am UTC
|
Joined: Dec 2006
Posts: 1,287 ontario
Sven Hebbard
Serious Member
|
Serious Member
Joined: Dec 2006
Posts: 1,287
ontario
|
ruben do more research before you make a choice you'll regret. 10 second HY35 a 9cm*2 holset SMALLER then the hx35w screen name is dacowgod on dsmtuner spec'd with a 2.0 6-bolt HY35 at around 37-38psi, the same as Ricky's. Gabe is on street tires and also has a blown turbo-to-manifold gasket 30+ psi by 4200 RPM ... which in my mind is instant.... ... I went from a 2.4 w/ the .70 AR HX40 @ 40-44psi by ~5000 down to a 2.0 with this 9cm open T3 HY35 wish spool by like 4200 and the fun factor went wayy up...I can spin this engine to 8500 comfortably now ... and its definitely not as torquey(should make the transmission happy) but the car is just so more fun to drive on the street... and at the track i'm faster now than ever.. The breakdown for my run in the video is: 60ft 1.8677 (best of the day) 330ft 4.8758 1/8 et 7.2219 1/8 mph 105.83 1000 et 9.2440 1000 mph 122.05 1/4et 10.9288 1/4mph 133.93 All this information was provided by dacow dog and jusmx141
|
|
|
Re: Who runs Holset
[Re: ruben silva]
#365846
December 02, 2011 02:43 am UTC
December 02, 2011 02:43 am UTC
|
Joined: Aug 2009
Posts: 4,783 Belleville Ontario
Jay Stacey
Senior Member, with Far TOO Much Time on Their Hands
|
Senior Member, with Far TOO Much Time on Their Hands
Joined: Aug 2009
Posts: 4,783
Belleville Ontario
|
I thought the hy35 would do better then that, Dosent a dinosour like a scm6152e hit full spool at like 4300rpm? and its a bolt on that dosent need a oil restrictor, and gives way more power
And sven, if I dont have balance shafts, how does that make it so i need a restrictor, When i removed the shaft, I also hogged out my oil relief witch lowered my oil pressure even more.. which to me would require less restriction. But i dont understand the shaft theory?
11.45@125, stock bottom end 6bolt 2g head. 272 hks cams. Holset hx35 Backyard biult!!
|
|
|
Re: Who runs Holset
[Re: ruben silva]
#365848
December 02, 2011 02:55 am UTC
December 02, 2011 02:55 am UTC
|
Joined: Dec 2006
Posts: 1,287 ontario
Sven Hebbard
Serious Member
|
Serious Member
Joined: Dec 2006
Posts: 1,287
ontario
|
Removing your balance shafts RAISES your op.. I know some guys seeing 85psi on start up on tuners The hy35 is a good sized turbo it's self. Scm6152e is a very poor designed turbo not even made anymore shafts were junk from what I read and presision doesn't even support them anymore so what does that tell you when the father kicks the son to the curb?. This is a verified set of HY35 maps and an HX35 map from HOLSET over the years. Pre 2003 HX35 in green 2003-04.5 HY35 in black 2004.5-present HY35 in red Hx 40 and super(in metric no lb/min) I'm having trouble finding a compressor map for a Scm6152e, So if you have one please put it up.
Last edited by Sven Hebbard; December 02, 2011 03:10 am UTC.
|
|
|
Re: Who runs Holset
[Re: ruben silva]
#365867
December 02, 2011 12:45 pm UTC
December 02, 2011 12:45 pm UTC
|
Joined: May 2010
Posts: 1,106 Saskatoon, Saskatchewan
Andrew Trapp
Serious Member
|
Serious Member
Joined: May 2010
Posts: 1,106
Saskatoon, Saskatchewan
|
In the full balance shaft delete it kicks up the oil pressure because the bearings for the front side are put in to block the oil passages, restricted flow increases the pressure. If you left your front shaft in and just pulled the belt, then you will not get the huge increases typically seen.
To counter the increased pressure, you can port out the relief hole. The only surefire way to know if you need a restrictor or not is to plumb in an oil pressure gauge, there is no other way. We can say 'typically' and 'generally' but your car could be the exception. All that is known with certainty is if you keep the oil pressure at the holset within their specs, you rule out a somewhat common and easy way to destroy it.
Ruben, are you looking for street & track, mainly street with lil track, or full track?
|
|
|
Re: Who runs Holset
[Re: ruben silva]
#366042
December 06, 2011 12:39 pm UTC
December 06, 2011 12:39 pm UTC
|
Joined: May 2010
Posts: 1,106 Saskatoon, Saskatchewan
Andrew Trapp
Serious Member
|
Serious Member
Joined: May 2010
Posts: 1,106
Saskatoon, Saskatchewan
|
45s should get you there, but it does depend a bit on your manifold.
Some people have luck with a straight from the turbo with a 45 at the pan, others this ends up kinking. If you could mock up the manifold and turbo, get the hose you will be using and just try placing it. You'll be able to see quickly what angles you will need to prevent a kink. Whatever the case, it always seems that two straights are always in a position where it will fatigue either into a kink or a break.
When I had mine hanging off of there, it would have been ideal for 30s, but I'm not sure they make them so I will probably go with two 45s.
Last edited by Andrew Trapp; December 06, 2011 12:40 pm UTC.
|
|
|
|
|