Ultra 94 has 10% Ehtanol, I find I get noticeably worse mileage in my Lancer ralliart. I have been using when possible shell V-power, or other Ethanol free 91 octane gas.

The manual calls for 93 or higher, but 91 is acceptable when higher is not available.

I am concerned about the Ethanol in the 94 having detrimental effects on my cars fuel system. My car also seems to like the Shell V-power and most other 91 that I can verify as being ethanol free.

Whatever happened to Pioneers 93 octane "magnum"?

oh no, i only use 94 and collect 5 times the points or whatever. get's me a free wash once every couple months. sometimes in less time, depending how much i drive the dsm.

i get knock with 89 or less..the odd occasion i've had to use it.

I don't know about the ralliart but I know that the older cars are not made to run with Ethanol, and when they do it actually makes them less efficient. I am also a 91 vpower user and am happy, any time I have tried anything else I haven't had good results.

Right on. Unless I think you tune it for ethanol

I read about that and Even the ones made to run it(flex fuel), Perform better with regular because they are tuned for regular. But if you tune it for strictly ethanol mix it will get same milege as regular.

All I run is the Ultra 94 in my 1992 DSM, stuff works great.
I can not see 10% Ehtanol harming any newer cars fuel system that calls for such a high Octain rating.
Addatives like Ehtanol are often expsected to be used in such fuels to increas it's detonation resistance.
The same is also done to winter gas they add some form of alchol to the mixture.
Other then the fuel losing a small amount of energy per galon I can't fathom it causing damage to the fuel system.

Do you have a wideband in the your Lancer ralliart perhaps a sencer is toast and it's just mixing pig ritch during crewsing ?

+1

Dont we spray methanol for the same reason?
If you not boosting hard V-Power seems like the right way to go.

Is this allot of boost for 91 pump gas

I ran 91oct all summer long while I was out east. Only high test available out there I always have to retune when I go home

Forcing 28-29 psi with 14 degrees of timing.
Some times 13 degrees when a bit of knock showed up

And yes I know she was running really hot 210 F
I need to up grade the cooling system big time.

Can't wait to see what she will do on Methenol

This is consistant with my Ralliart also. It's absolutely horrible on gas, at least with the 94 Oct. But the manual says use a minimum of 93 Oct, so 94 it is. I don't really like to use 91 where I can avoid it.

There's no pooched sensors in either of our cars, that's just how it is. Also, stock the ralliart runs something like 18psi boost. With the Tactrix openport 2.0 (which I have) we can tune to accept the 91 oct fuel, but that technically voids the warranty on the car. So I'm not touching it, I'll just stick to 94 oct.

I have noticed the same thing. 91 from Shell is the only gas with no ethanol in it. I saw a significant increase in gas mileage on my 330ci when I switched from 94 to Shell 91.

It's a cornspiracy!!!!

Well guys it's not rocket science. Use 91 if your gonna cruise like grandma and go for the best mileage. Use 94 if your car has any sort of decent power and you like to have fun. About a decade ago when my buddy and I had stockish DSM's we noticed the same thing with shell 91, so it seems like it hasn't changed since. With that said I use 94 in the DSM and Ralliart. I might be tempted to try the Shell 91 if I go for a long cruise in the Ralliart and mileage is my #1 priority. Ultra 94 has always been known to burn quicker. Same as race gas which I use regularly on the streets too. $100 for 20 litres. You gotta pay to play boys

What kind of mileage are you guys getting anyways in your Ralliarts?

When kent comes down east again he promises me a bunch of gallons of 94, down here 91 is the best it gets I would gladly pay to have 94 and be able to beat a car that much more with out fear of knock

The 94 that Petro Canada sells here in Quebec seems to be garbage. I usually run 93 from Mobile in Vermont, with my tune I get no knock. If I run low and am forced to fill up on this side of the border, I do so with the 94 but I get loads of knock any time I get onto it hard, burn it up and refill with US 93 and it's back to normal. Last I checked it was about $1.10 for the 93 and $1.65 for the 94.

I wonder if the octane standards between the countries are different.

55 cents difference between 93 and 94?

Between Canada and Quebexico, I wouldn't doubt it



That's not normal by any means! IIRC it's typically about 30 cents more from regular 87 to 94.

The best mileage I've gotten in my ralliart in a steady cruise was 27.6 mpg avg, on 91, best on 94 is about 23 mpg avg according to the computer. I'm not trying to cheap out, I just don't think the 94 swill is what its cracked up to be. Who am I to say, I drive like grandma anyways.

I just take it easy I see tons of cops on my way to work every day, the OPP here are relentless, got pulled over Saturday half a click from my house, just checking for drinking and driving. I am just wondering if the vehicle was intended to handle the 94 which has it octane up that high because of ethanol.

Porsche guys are saying Shell V-Power has more btu energy than the 94 I just read it the other day will have to see if I can dig it up.

Also people keep talking about RON for some reason, he's a popular guy.

RON= Research Octane Number

I've always wondered how the 91 compared to 94 with ethanol. Since day one, I've always run strictly 94 in the Eclipse. I normally tune to be just on the edge of knock, so running any lower octane would be an issue.

Years back, coming home from the track, getting low on fuel & no Sunoco near by, I ended up having to grab some 91 (probably got half a tank). Now just to see, I got into boost a couple times & didn't seem to see any knock. Now there was probably a small amount of octane boost left in the tank but after that, I've always been curious to do a real compairson (but never have).

He means Quebec and Vermont. He said Countries, not Provinces.

Either/or really, Quebec likes to be "distinct" so the French octane rating probably is different so that it costs more and gives another avenue for corruption

Jason I can't wait to see my family’s faces when I land home with a DSM full of petroleum.
It's going to feel like a death trap driving around with it all

Wonder how much I can fit in such a small fuselage

Found this little bit of info

It's a good read.

http://www.businessweek.com/lifestyle/content/may2009/bw20090514_058678.htm

I had this theory about the gas spooling out east because of no one buying it on regular bases in the off seasons. I just never got around to looking into it. All I know is my car did not like it at all went from no knock to massive amounts of detonation.

Looks like I was on to something give this one a read guys.

http://www.fuel-testers.com/list_e10_engine_damage.html

you're right! that is a great read!

I remember reading a long time ago on a Honda Gold Wing board about higher Octane gas being BAD for the bike...as well as money thrown away....But I never did figure out why it was bad.

If I am correct, if a vehicle is programmed to run on reg 87 octane then putting higher grade gas in them will not give any benifit as the computer does not advance timing to accomidate for the slower burning fuel.
Reg gas explodes faster so with that a vehicle thats looking for that faster burn would not benifit from the slower burn of higher octane fuels.
In theory a vehicle timed for 87 octane gas will make more power then that same vehicle running a higher octane fuel with no adjustments to timing.
Newer vehicles that are epromed for 91 min have some ability to deal with reg gas by retarding ignition to accomidate for this (losing power in the process) Most of us know more timing means more power (with out knock)

100 % correct on it not giving any benefits to a vehicle that dose not require high detonation resistant fuel. From the sources that I have looked into thus far that seem authentic and not just some one's opinions on what they think is going on in a combustion engine is that higher octane fuel is not how ever slower burning, rather more stable or harder to burn once the chemical reaction is properly ignited it burns the same speed but the end result has more un-burnt fuel. Additives can affect the duration of this reaction, after all ethanol burns at a different speed then petroleum. 100 % petroleum not matter what grade with out all the different chemicals and additives will burn the same speed once properly ignited so combustion can take place. How ever with all the refining and all of the different chemicals going into each petrol companies vats of fuel, It really comes down to what's in it. Is it even petroleum any more or solvent (XXX69 made up chemical). I have spent countless hours researching the topic of petroleum and there are allot of mixed reviews and internet opinions

like this little bit of info.

http://motorcycleriderz.motionsforum.com/t196-octane-is-not-how-fast-a-fuel-burns

That's why some guys go to the track, throw in race gas and claim it made them go slower, when all they had to do was tune it out

In the past when I have driven up north to Hearst Ontario in the DSM (1,000 km drive from Toronto), Gravenhurst is the last place you can get 94 octane. I usually make it to North Bay with the 94 octane, then I am forced to run Shell 91. Same tune, with the meth spraying and minimum of 30psi boost, the car knocks like a SOB on Shell 91. I have tried putting the boost down to 25 psi and it still knocks on the Shell 91. I just leave it as is and cruise the remaining 500km and do the same thing on my way back up to Gravenhurst where I can finally get 94 octane again

So yes I have done back to back testing in my DSM on the evo3 16g and the FP3065. To sum it up, shell 91 sucks for anything other than good mileage.

Now if you have a stock car with OEM AFR maps which are usually in the 9's for most cars, running a lower octane gas may actually make the car feel faster, thus why owners of other cars may claim the 91 octane is better.

Reza, I usually get around 12.5l/100km in town, and 9.5l/100km highway in my Ralliart

I've always used 94 in my 2g when I was driving it. Then again I never used Shell 91 so wouldn't be able to make a distinction.

I can never find 94 but I've always ran 91 in my speed6, I find I get good mileage but my tune is dependent on the 91 anyway so I'm stuck. Up here 94 is a fabled myth

Well... I can for sure say that my 50/50 mix of Shell 91 and 100LL AVGAS lowers my knock count and increases my gas milage. Also, the car just loves it!

wish i had access to avgas goddam it's stinky sh!t! glad I was cruising in front of you that day you were up here in o-town. lol

Actually, AVGAS doesn't smell that bad, it's Jet you have to look out for. A single drop will make you smell all day.